Five Ball Hilt spadroons

Jim McDougall · 3rd July 2009, 11:31 PM

Yay Jeff!!! That was the article I was trying to think of!!! Thank you for including that, and for coming in on this. It would appear this topic is even farther out of my depth than I thought, and its great to see revitalized research with all of the top guns (er, swords!) in on this.

Thanks so much,
All the best,
Jim

Hotspur · 4th July 2009, 04:30 AM

A better look of my two eagle spadroons. The five ball is one of the ubiquotous Ketland typethat could easily be as late as the 1820s or 1830s but as it is ivory and not bone, that would more likely predate 1812. The fellow on the right could be the first decade 19th century and more likely right at the cusp of the century. There ar eno martial engravings on that one at all, which is a bit unusual for the genre, The middle is a sabre of the Osborn type of weeping eagle and possibly as late as the 1812 war vintage. It more reminds the the three together as Moe, Larry and Curly. My three stooges. The dirk is undefined but post 1872 and shares the same scabbard as some of the Shriners middle east looking sabres. The sabre on the right is similar to some of the mid 20th century Italian air force hilts but has a naval flip-up basket. A Horster blade. The grip had been knid of scuffed sharkskin and rather than refinish white, it is black stove paint. It is also missing its decorative crown nut and I put it together with a standard cutlery nut. Both the dirk and the late sabre were at giveaway prices but I had gone to pick up the dirk specifically (unloved and unknown by the seller).

Anyway, spadroons on the left. TWo very different blades in that the Ketland seems to have been a better rolling mill endeavor. The difference to the Bolton blade is just that, more irregular about its margins and less mass produced. Although labeled in the books as Ketland, the mess of cutlers in Birmingham at the time makes any batch of them by any number of shops. Blades at one, engraving and gilt at another, castings from yet a third and then possibly actually assembled in the Ketland shop but most likely contracted right up to the point up to delivery of entire swords to Ketland, who then acted as a distributor. The same thing was going on with their firearms, from what I read of that business.

Cheers

Hotspur; Mark at Old Swords has an immense database for Birmingham

3rd July 2009, 11:31 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,190	Yay Jeff!!! That was the article I was trying to think of!!! Thank you for including that, and for coming in on this. It would appear this topic is even farther out of my depth than I thought, and its great to see revitalized research with all of the top guns (er, swords!) in on this. Thanks so much, All the best, Jim

4th July 2009, 04:30 AM	#2
Hotspur Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Nipmuc USA Posts: 508	A better look of my two eagle spadroons. The five ball is one of the ubiquotous Ketland typethat could easily be as late as the 1820s or 1830s but as it is ivory and not bone, that would more likely predate 1812. The fellow on the right could be the first decade 19th century and more likely right at the cusp of the century. There ar eno martial engravings on that one at all, which is a bit unusual for the genre, The middle is a sabre of the Osborn type of weeping eagle and possibly as late as the 1812 war vintage. It more reminds the the three together as Moe, Larry and Curly. My three stooges. The dirk is undefined but post 1872 and shares the same scabbard as some of the Shriners middle east looking sabres. The sabre on the right is similar to some of the mid 20th century Italian air force hilts but has a naval flip-up basket. A Horster blade. The grip had been knid of scuffed sharkskin and rather than refinish white, it is black stove paint. It is also missing its decorative crown nut and I put it together with a standard cutlery nut. Both the dirk and the late sabre were at giveaway prices but I had gone to pick up the dirk specifically (unloved and unknown by the seller). Anyway, spadroons on the left. TWo very different blades in that the Ketland seems to have been a better rolling mill endeavor. The difference to the Bolton blade is just that, more irregular about its margins and less mass produced. Although labeled in the books as Ketland, the mess of cutlers in Birmingham at the time makes any batch of them by any number of shops. Blades at one, engraving and gilt at another, castings from yet a third and then possibly actually assembled in the Ketland shop but most likely contracted right up to the point up to delivery of entire swords to Ketland, who then acted as a distributor. The same thing was going on with their firearms, from what I read of that business. Cheers Hotspur; Mark at Old Swords has an immense database for Birmingham