German? Prussian?

Yustas · 23rd May 2009, 05:00 AM

Awesome research, thank you. Still waiting for more pictures.

Jim McDougall · 23rd May 2009, 06:06 AM

My pleasure Yustas! I hope we can turn up more defined information of this and look forward to more pictures..especially of the marking and if there are any numeric stamps or other markings.

All the best,
Jim

ingvar · 23rd May 2009, 08:04 AM

Here some more images of this saber...

There is no numeric markings.

Its known that Weyersberg, Kirschbaum & Cie was making sword replicas. To me this model looks like a 1855 Bavarian Artillery Officer's sword i've seen once. That one was made by WKC circa 1910. It makes sense that a replica wouldn't have a serial number.

I don't know much about German swordsmanship tho, just a thought.

ingvar · 24th May 2009, 04:20 AM

Well i didn't mean "replica" as how we understand this word now. Quality-wise it was indistinguishable from the original, as we know WKC products are hand forged to this day.

What i more meant to say it was a "special order".

Here's image of a very similar presentation version of a Bavarian Artillery Officer's Model 1855

HERE is a similar saber, Solingen-made too, but identical to a sample of "Imperial Bavarian Artillery Sword" in a 1906 Eickhorn catalogue. This identical sword appears on Page 124 of the Imperial catalogue and is listed as Model No. 266.

on one of the internet auctions this sword was listed as "rare ww1 era german artillery sword"

another one

it has a personalized blade, so no maker marks.

"...An illustration of this pattern sword appears on page 426 of Swords of Germany 1900/1945 by John R. Angolia..."

"...This etch pattern matches Pattern No. 492, "Klinge zu Mannschafts-Extra-Säbel" as shown in the 1908 Carl Eickhorn sales catalog..."

Jim McDougall · 24th May 2009, 08:16 PM

Thank you very much Ingvar, for checking those references and for the detail on this. It did seem like this might be of the type issued to artillery units and other ersatz units in WWI. I understood what you meant by special issue, which these ersatz units would have been as they were replacement units and equipment would have been special ordered.

All best regards,
Jim

P.S. I'd still love to discover how the Bezdek reference arrived at the M1813 hussar sabre designator for this.

24th May 2009, 04:20 AM	#4
ingvar Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 11	Well i didn't mean "replica" as how we understand this word now. Quality-wise it was indistinguishable from the original, as we know WKC products are hand forged to this day. What i more meant to say it was a "special order". Here's image of a very similar presentation version of a Bavarian Artillery Officer's Model 1855 HERE is a similar saber, Solingen-made too, but identical to a sample of "Imperial Bavarian Artillery Sword" in a 1906 Eickhorn catalogue. This identical sword appears on Page 124 of the Imperial catalogue and is listed as Model No. 266. on one of the internet auctions this sword was listed as "rare ww1 era german artillery sword" another one it has a personalized blade, so no maker marks. "...An illustration of this pattern sword appears on page 426 of Swords of Germany 1900/1945 by John R. Angolia..." "...This etch pattern matches Pattern No. 492, "Klinge zu Mannschafts-Extra-Säbel" as shown in the 1908 Carl Eickhorn sales catalog..." Last edited by ingvar; 24th May 2009 at 05:11 AM.

23rd May 2009, 05:00 AM	#1
Yustas Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 40	Awesome research, thank you. Still waiting for more pictures.

23rd May 2009, 06:06 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,191	My pleasure Yustas! I hope we can turn up more defined information of this and look forward to more pictures..especially of the marking and if there are any numeric stamps or other markings. All the best, Jim

23rd May 2009, 08:04 AM	#3
ingvar Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 11	Here some more images of this saber... There is no numeric markings. Its known that Weyersberg, Kirschbaum & Cie was making sword replicas. To me this model looks like a 1855 Bavarian Artillery Officer's sword i've seen once. That one was made by WKC circa 1910. It makes sense that a replica wouldn't have a serial number. I don't know much about German swordsmanship tho, just a thought.

24th May 2009, 08:16 PM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,191	Thank you very much Ingvar, for checking those references and for the detail on this. It did seem like this might be of the type issued to artillery units and other ersatz units in WWI. I understood what you meant by special issue, which these ersatz units would have been as they were replacement units and equipment would have been special ordered. All best regards, Jim P.S. I'd still love to discover how the Bezdek reference arrived at the M1813 hussar sabre designator for this.