Soul of the Keris

Pusaka · 19th February 2009, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PenangsangII

actually, keris is one of the best "self defense" weapons (physically speaking) - if you know how to use it effectively.

You would be happy to fight me with your keris if I had a sword, who would have the advantage?

Lew · 19th February 2009, 08:57 PM

Some how I would prefer a parang or klewang in a fight. Keris are really only stabbing weapons and stabbing alone has many drawbacks in a duel against a longer heavier sword or in a malay involving multipule opponents with longer slashing weapons

Lew

Jussi M. · 19th February 2009, 09:00 PM

Thanks,

J.

kronckew · 19th February 2009, 10:04 PM

video version of previous:

Linky

classic serendipity

spielberg said harrison had the runs that day & the longer sword vs. whip scene was cut, saved spielberg 300,000$ and 3 days of shooting too

Pusaka · 19th February 2009, 11:48 PM

A keris is good for defence against a person who also has a keris/knife or is unarmed. If someone has a staff, sword or any heavier weapon your in trouble because you cant block a strike with your keris. If I took a swipe at you with a sword or staff and you tried to block it with your keris it would fly out of your hand. The only way you could win with your keris would be if you were at a much higher level of ability.

David · 20th February 2009, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pusaka

A keris is good for defence against a person who also has a keris/knife or is unarmed. If someone has a staff, sword or any heavier weapon your in trouble because you cant block a strike with your keris. If I took a swipe at you with a sword or staff and you tried to block it with your keris it would fly out of your hand. The only way you could win with your keris would be if you were at a much higher level of ability.

Yes Pusaka, and as Jussi has pointed out, if someone has a gun your sword or staff is useless. I fail to see the point of this line of discussion.

Lew · 20th February 2009, 05:05 AM

David

That really depends on how close the guy with gun is standing away from you. A very skilled and fast knife fighter can be quite deadly within 2-3ft.

Especially if the gunmen does not see the knife. Years ago the NYC transit police found a gunmen minus one hand which was still holding on to the gun. Seems he was in the middle of a robbery on the train when some guy standing off to the side whipped out a 10" custom forged Bowie knife and severed his gun hand with one swipe. The police arrested both of them. Later one of the police ordered a bowie from the same maker

True story

Lew

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQE4f...eature=related

Pusaka · 20th February 2009, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOUIEBLADES

David

That really depends on how close the guy with gun is standing away from you. A very skilled and fast knife fighter can be quite deadly within 2-3ft.

Especially if the gunmen does not see the knife. Years ago the NYC transit police found a gunmen minus one hand which was still holding on to the gun. Seems he was in the middle of a robbey on the train when some guy standing off to the side whipped out a 10" custom forged Bowie knife and severed his gun hand with one swipe. The police arrested both of them. Later one of the police ordered a bowie from the same maker

True story

Lew

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQE4f...eature=related

If That happened in the UK the gunman would get compensation and the guy who tried to defend himself would probably get locked up

PenangsangII · 20th February 2009, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pusaka

You would be happy to fight me with your keris if I had a sword, who would have the advantage?

Yes, I would be glad to..... in the confined space of my apartment......

You are also talking about the "soul" of keris..... if it means anything to you, will render your sword, golok or even guns useless....

Well, they wont simply invented keris as a weapon for nothing

Pusaka · 20th February 2009, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PenangsangII

You are also talking about the "soul" of keris..... if it means anything to you, will render your sword, golok or even guns useless....

Well, they wont simply invented keris as a weapon for nothing

Yes that's why I very carefully said " as a physical weapon", I know you can use the Ilmu (knowledge of the eight points)

David · 20th February 2009, 01:20 PM

Yes, the element of surprise is always a factor, but that is pretty self-evident, isn't it? As is the skill level of the practitioner. So i guess i still don't really see the point of discussing how well a keris would do against a pedang or staff...or a gun, nor do i see it's relavence to the topic, Soul of the Keris.

Jussi M. · 20th February 2009, 03:35 PM

Keris 1, French and British nuclear subs 0

Thanks,

J

Jussi M. · 20th February 2009, 03:40 PM

Keris 1, Mike Tyson 0

Thanks,

J

Pusaka · 20th February 2009, 05:16 PM

That's one foxy lady

Well the Soul of Keris is the name of the Keris fighting dvd, which strangely enough is about keris fighting. I was talking about keris fighting also so it is relevant. To say keris fighting is not relevant to the keris is like saying sword fighting has nothing to do with swords.

I dont think PenangsangII was talking about the element of surprise, I understood that he was talking about Ilmu which is the esoteric use of the keris in combat.

19th February 2009, 09:00 PM	#3
Jussi M. Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 235	Thanks, J. Last edited by Jussi M.; 19th February 2009 at 09:18 PM.

20th February 2009, 05:05 AM	#7
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	David That really depends on how close the guy with gun is standing away from you. A very skilled and fast knife fighter can be quite deadly within 2-3ft. Especially if the gunmen does not see the knife. Years ago the NYC transit police found a gunmen minus one hand which was still holding on to the gun. Seems he was in the middle of a robbery on the train when some guy standing off to the side whipped out a 10" custom forged Bowie knife and severed his gun hand with one swipe. The police arrested both of them. Later one of the police ordered a bowie from the same maker True story Lew http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQE4f...eature=related Last edited by LOUIEBLADES; 20th February 2009 at 12:39 PM.

19th February 2009, 08:57 PM	#2
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Some how I would prefer a parang or klewang in a fight. Keris are really only stabbing weapons and stabbing alone has many drawbacks in a duel against a longer heavier sword or in a malay involving multipule opponents with longer slashing weapons Lew

19th February 2009, 10:04 PM	#4
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,249	video version of previous: Linky classic serendipity spielberg said harrison had the runs that day & the longer sword vs. whip scene was cut, saved spielberg 300,000$ and 3 days of shooting too

19th February 2009, 11:48 PM	#5
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	A keris is good for defence against a person who also has a keris/knife or is unarmed. If someone has a staff, sword or any heavier weapon your in trouble because you cant block a strike with your keris. If I took a swipe at you with a sword or staff and you tried to block it with your keris it would fly out of your hand. The only way you could win with your keris would be if you were at a much higher level of ability.

20th February 2009, 01:20 PM	#11
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,237	Yes, the element of surprise is always a factor, but that is pretty self-evident, isn't it? As is the skill level of the practitioner. So i guess i still don't really see the point of discussing how well a keris would do against a pedang or staff...or a gun, nor do i see it's relavence to the topic, Soul of the Keris.

20th February 2009, 03:35 PM	#12
Jussi M. Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 235	Keris 1, French and British nuclear subs 0 Thanks, J

20th February 2009, 03:40 PM	#13
Jussi M. Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 235	Keris 1, Mike Tyson 0 Thanks, J

20th February 2009, 05:16 PM	#14
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	That's one foxy lady Well the Soul of Keris is the name of the Keris fighting dvd, which strangely enough is about keris fighting. I was talking about keris fighting also so it is relevant. To say keris fighting is not relevant to the keris is like saying sword fighting has nothing to do with swords. I dont think PenangsangII was talking about the element of surprise, I understood that he was talking about Ilmu which is the esoteric use of the keris in combat.