Crucible Steel ?

Jens Nordlunde · 28th March 2005, 09:48 AM

Hi Rick,

My knowledge of how the blades were made has been very little, until I read the following thread by Gt Obach http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=503 and also till I read the book ‘Persian Steel’, Oxford University Press 2000, by James Allan and Brian Gilmour, where James Allan quotes R.B.M.Binning: A Journal of two years travel in Persia, Ceylon etc., 2 vol. London 1857, and Massalski: ‘Préparation de l’acier damassé en Perse’, Annuarie du Journal des Mines de Russie, 1841.

Th.H.Heldley also writes something in his book Damascening on Steel and Iron, as Practised in India. London 1892, about blade making in India – but unfortunately his description is more than short.

Unfortunately I cant quote from Persian Steel, as there is the copyright to consider, and it would be two to three pages, but I can recommend you to try to get the book at your library.

RSword’s comment on how different patterns on blades can occur is interesting, as it must have been difficult for the smiths to keep the same heat all over the blade, but I also think that if there were small traces of other metals along the blade, the pattern would change.

The pattern on your blade looks to me as if it is in relief, which is strange. I think I have seen it before, but at the moment I don’t remember where, but to me it suggests an acid treatment of some kind. How is the colour of the blade, is it a ‘dull’ grey?

Jens

Rick · 28th March 2005, 05:02 PM

" The pattern on your blade looks to me as if it is in relief, which is strange. I think I have seen it before, but at the moment I don’t remember where, but to me it suggests an acid treatment of some kind. How is the colour of the blade, is it a ‘dull’ grey? "

Hi Jens , yes it is fairly grey .

Lee · 28th March 2005, 06:15 PM

My opinion is that the pattern is arising from layers and the grain pattern of the steel.

Gt Obach · 28th March 2005, 07:05 PM

ditto
nice blade... looks like a flat laminate... and lotsa layers

Greg

Jens Nordlunde · 28th March 2005, 08:06 PM

Hi Lee and Greg,
Yes to me it seems like that - but how, and why?
To me, there seems to be, at the moment to the question than answers.

Jens

tom hyle · 29th March 2005, 01:21 AM

How and why? Folding, and because that's how steel was made, alloyed, and homogenized (other than crucible steel); no mystery there.

28th March 2005, 08:06 PM	#5
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Hi Lee and Greg, Yes to me it seems like that - but how, and why? To me, there seems to be, at the moment to the question than answers. Jens Last edited by Jens Nordlunde; 28th March 2005 at 08:18 PM.

28th March 2005, 09:48 AM	#1
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Hi Rick, My knowledge of how the blades were made has been very little, until I read the following thread by Gt Obach http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=503 and also till I read the book ‘Persian Steel’, Oxford University Press 2000, by James Allan and Brian Gilmour, where James Allan quotes R.B.M.Binning: A Journal of two years travel in Persia, Ceylon etc., 2 vol. London 1857, and Massalski: ‘Préparation de l’acier damassé en Perse’, Annuarie du Journal des Mines de Russie, 1841. Th.H.Heldley also writes something in his book Damascening on Steel and Iron, as Practised in India. London 1892, about blade making in India – but unfortunately his description is more than short. Unfortunately I cant quote from Persian Steel, as there is the copyright to consider, and it would be two to three pages, but I can recommend you to try to get the book at your library. RSword’s comment on how different patterns on blades can occur is interesting, as it must have been difficult for the smiths to keep the same heat all over the blade, but I also think that if there were small traces of other metals along the blade, the pattern would change. The pattern on your blade looks to me as if it is in relief, which is strange. I think I have seen it before, but at the moment I don’t remember where, but to me it suggests an acid treatment of some kind. How is the colour of the blade, is it a ‘dull’ grey? Jens

28th March 2005, 05:02 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	" The pattern on your blade looks to me as if it is in relief, which is strange. I think I have seen it before, but at the moment I don’t remember where, but to me it suggests an acid treatment of some kind. How is the colour of the blade, is it a ‘dull’ grey? " Hi Jens , yes it is fairly grey .

28th March 2005, 06:15 PM	#3
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 932	My opinion is that the pattern is arising from layers and the grain pattern of the steel.

28th March 2005, 07:05 PM	#4
Gt Obach Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 116	ditto nice blade... looks like a flat laminate... and lotsa layers Greg

29th March 2005, 01:21 AM	#6
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	How and why? Folding, and because that's how steel was made, alloyed, and homogenized (other than crucible steel); no mystery there.