keris blade for comment.

capt.smash · 12th March 2005, 11:35 PM

Thanks Henk thanks for the reply

yeah its a great shame about the dress but for me the blade is the most important part...this is the second good quality bali blade that i have got in almost identical dress and like the last this is one for keeps and restoration.

Do you have any ideahs on the significance of the animals ?mabe a makers marks or perhaps something to do with a hindu fable or something they are a lovely detail

Rick · 12th March 2005, 11:54 PM

Nah ,
Made in Milwaukee .

Seriously though capt. , thanks for showing me something I have never before seen in a Bali blade .
The Tiger and the Bull are symbols of bravery , no ?

Very interesting features .

Henk · 13th March 2005, 09:42 AM

To be honest I really don't know what the meaning is of those symbols on the keris. Ricks remark is a posibility. I've seen such a keris in good condition in a very serious collection. I was even allowed to keep it in my hands. The only thing I could do at that moment was to put up a face like this,

and enjoying a marvelous keris.

I always thought that such a keris was made for a wealthy person who could afford a keris with gold ornaments. The keris I mentioned had a dress of gold and ivory, that is pointing in such a direction. Symbols of power and strength, reflecting the position of the owner.

capt.smash · 13th March 2005, 04:02 PM

"made in Milwaukee" LOL

Rick · 13th March 2005, 06:00 PM

This is probably the antithesis of critical thinking but ,

While I agree that this blade most likely belonged to a higher status person I also have read , on this forum IIRC (take it for what you will) , that such adornments were often awarded by the sultan for an outstanding act of bravery on the part of one of his minions .

Silly romantic stuff probably but it would seem a particularly appropriate reward and possibly even fits Ruel's fashion criteria .

Always remember , you read it on the internet .

Henk · 13th March 2005, 08:13 PM

In the book by Tammens I found something about this.

Applying gold on keris blades started in the 17th century. On the ganja of many kerisses gold figures have been applied. Mostly two animals, the macan (tiger) and the gajah (elephant) symbols for the two empires Mataram and Modjopahit and sometimes the banteng (wild cow) as a symbol of strength.
It is said that the well known Sultan Agung took the initiative in applying these golden ornaments, to honour those kerisses, that played a part in the change from Modjopahit to the empire of Mataram.
The engraving of flowers and claspers on the wilah is decoration done in a positive relief. Applying with gold rises the decoration from the surface.

empu kumis · 13th March 2005, 09:27 PM

Hello Kerislovers,

the animals on top of the ganja are not original but made recently. The blade itself is not a good one because of the low condition. Remember Balinese Blades are polished not etched like the Javanese. Etching of Balinese blades came up maybe in the 70ties because of the lack of caretaking. To get a Balinese keris in good first class condition is almost impossibleSee: Hamzuri 1982-83 Petunjuk Singkat Tentang Keris p. 8.

Animals on Balinese blades (ganja) are sometimes present even of gold and sometimes like the Javanese Singa Barong (not a tiger), Gajah, winged horse and so on. impossible.
See: Hamzuri 1982-83 Petunjuk Singkat Tentang Keris p. 8.

Its said the meaning of this animals is a date and also like a medal of honour for bravery especially under Sultan Agung.

empu kumis

12th March 2005, 11:35 PM	#1
capt.smash Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Devon ,England Posts: 80	Thanks Henk thanks for the reply yeah its a great shame about the dress but for me the blade is the most important part...this is the second good quality bali blade that i have got in almost identical dress and like the last this is one for keeps and restoration. Do you have any ideahs on the significance of the animals ?mabe a makers marks or perhaps something to do with a hindu fable or something they are a lovely detail

12th March 2005, 11:54 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,376	Nah , Made in Milwaukee . Seriously though capt. , thanks for showing me something I have never before seen in a Bali blade . The Tiger and the Bull are symbols of bravery , no ? Very interesting features .

13th March 2005, 09:42 AM	#3
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	To be honest I really don't know what the meaning is of those symbols on the keris. Ricks remark is a posibility. I've seen such a keris in good condition in a very serious collection. I was even allowed to keep it in my hands. The only thing I could do at that moment was to put up a face like this, and enjoying a marvelous keris. I always thought that such a keris was made for a wealthy person who could afford a keris with gold ornaments. The keris I mentioned had a dress of gold and ivory, that is pointing in such a direction. Symbols of power and strength, reflecting the position of the owner.

13th March 2005, 04:02 PM	#4
capt.smash Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Devon ,England Posts: 80	"made in Milwaukee" LOL

13th March 2005, 06:00 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,376	This is probably the antithesis of critical thinking but , While I agree that this blade most likely belonged to a higher status person I also have read , on this forum IIRC (take it for what you will) , that such adornments were often awarded by the sultan for an outstanding act of bravery on the part of one of his minions . Silly romantic stuff probably but it would seem a particularly appropriate reward and possibly even fits Ruel's fashion criteria . Always remember , you read it on the internet .

13th March 2005, 08:13 PM	#6
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	In the book by Tammens I found something about this. Applying gold on keris blades started in the 17th century. On the ganja of many kerisses gold figures have been applied. Mostly two animals, the macan (tiger) and the gajah (elephant) symbols for the two empires Mataram and Modjopahit and sometimes the banteng (wild cow) as a symbol of strength. It is said that the well known Sultan Agung took the initiative in applying these golden ornaments, to honour those kerisses, that played a part in the change from Modjopahit to the empire of Mataram. The engraving of flowers and claspers on the wilah is decoration done in a positive relief. Applying with gold rises the decoration from the surface.

13th March 2005, 09:27 PM	#7
empu kumis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 17	Hello Kerislovers, the animals on top of the ganja are not original but made recently. The blade itself is not a good one because of the low condition. Remember Balinese Blades are polished not etched like the Javanese. Etching of Balinese blades came up maybe in the 70ties because of the lack of caretaking. To get a Balinese keris in good first class condition is almost impossibleSee: Hamzuri 1982-83 Petunjuk Singkat Tentang Keris p. 8. Animals on Balinese blades (ganja) are sometimes present even of gold and sometimes like the Javanese Singa Barong (not a tiger), Gajah, winged horse and so on. impossible. See: Hamzuri 1982-83 Petunjuk Singkat Tentang Keris p. 8. Its said the meaning of this animals is a date and also like a medal of honour for bravery especially under Sultan Agung. empu kumis