Movies and Edged Weapons Pt. 2

Bill M · 31st August 2007, 02:15 AM

How about "Real Glory?"

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0031842/

Moro, kampilan, Barong, Kris, Krag.

Yannis · 31st August 2007, 05:41 PM

I saw "300" just few days ago and as a Greek allow me to say few things

1. It is not the first time, and I suppose it is not the last, that Hollywood makes its own "version" of history and mythology. I am glad that, at least this one, it had no "happy end" as usual, against the known facts.

2. There are plus and minus in the film accuracy. For example, there was no pro Persian conspiracy and traitors for gold inside the city. Spartan culture had no value for gold, even their coins were very heavy iron ones.

3. There are a lot of mistakes on battle. Spartans superiority was not the kung fu style of the movie, but the strong chain of heavy armored warriors (phalanx), unusual or unknown at the time, were one covers with his shield the next in the chain. This tactic with "othismos" (push against the enemy) could break big armies of lone wolfs. This tactic was used and developed further later by Alexander and Romans.

4. Of course they were not naked on battle, but... Generally in Greek armies they were some naked soldiers named "psili" or "gymnites" (same root with word Gymnasium, were athletes were naked).

5. Spartans were naked only before the battle, to wash themselves and fix their hair. They wanted to fight in a celebration

6. Spartan women, against the belief, were possibly the most free women of the era. They had their own property, they had speech on public matters and they had a lot of sports, like javelin and wrestling. If they had too, they could fight in battles and actually they had win, without their men, Pyros, the mighty king of Epirus, who came to conquer Sparta a time where men where in other war!

7. The phrase "Then we shall fight in the shade" is not Hollywood script. It is supposed said by Diinekis as Herodotus wrote.

Etc. etc. We were not there, the history was written by Greeks (but not all of them loved Spartans) etc etc

The real thing is that this battle, and few more after that, gave to this world something important: The chance to Athenians to build their culture (theatre, drama, history etc) and Democracy so, at least, we have a name for our modern political systems

I have a sympathy for Persians, who also gave too much to the world, but I dont personally like pyramid style empires. And of course Xerxes (the great) was not this kind of freak that the movie shows.

more about the battle in
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Thermopylae

Rick · 2nd September 2007, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Marsh

How about "Real Glory?"

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0031842/

Moro, kampilan, Barong, Kris, Krag.

Love this movie .

Of course the U.S. imperialistic slant to everything is obvious; still it is the only movie that I am aware of thar covers any aspect of the Moro Wars.

Lots of Hollywood legends in this flick.

I believe it may still be found in VHS format.

CharlesS · 3rd September 2007, 12:45 AM

Great old movie, and is still on VHS.

Surprising attention to detail in Moro weapons, though not 100% of the time....so much so that I think many real kampillan and barong may actually be props.

Rick · 3rd September 2007, 01:27 AM

Oh God,

Let's not go there; if that's the case just think about the leftover props from Zulu .

Bill M · 3rd September 2007, 01:54 AM

The barongs, kris and kampilans did look authentic. There was one VERY shiny kris.

But the "Datu" was a Russian actor and carried a Balinese keris. The leader of the Moro was a Japanese actor. He did have a big honking kampilan.

But I think they pulled it off rather well. Really liked the movie.

Bill M · 3rd September 2007, 02:11 AM

Maybe a few of those Zulu spears found their way up to the Sudan?

Grand scale of a movie with Charlton Heston playing General "Chinese" Gordon and -- no kidding -- Sir Lawrence Olivier as the "Mahdi" aka the "Expected One."

Quite a few kaskaras and some really good spears.

1966 -- cast of thousands that were not digital! Real guys on camels and horses. Remington rifles.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0060588/

"In this epic tale of the British Army's travails in North Africa, two acting giants appear together for the first and only time: Charlton Heston portrays General Charles "Chinese" Gordon, who in 1883 led the defense of the Sudanese garrison against a Muslim rebellion. And Laurence Olivier plays the instigator of that uprising -- Mahdi, the "spiritual leader" of the Sudan. Robert Ardrey received an Oscar nomination for his screenplay."

Rick · 3rd September 2007, 10:07 PM

Got that one on DVD, also the early version of The Four Feathers; the recent version is junk.

ariel · 4th September 2007, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Marsh

The barongs, kris and kampilans did look authentic. There was one VERY shiny kris.

But the "Datu" was a Russian actor and carried a Balinese keris. The leader of the Moro was a Japanese actor. He did have a big honking kampilan.

But I think they pulled it off rather well. Really liked the movie.

Vladimir Sokoloff specialized in "exotic" roles: he was the wise elderly Mexican in the " Magnificient Seven"
Sometimes, it is good to have an unidentifiable accent

31st August 2007, 05:41 PM	#2
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	I saw "300" just few days ago and as a Greek allow me to say few things 1. It is not the first time, and I suppose it is not the last, that Hollywood makes its own "version" of history and mythology. I am glad that, at least this one, it had no "happy end" as usual, against the known facts. 2. There are plus and minus in the film accuracy. For example, there was no pro Persian conspiracy and traitors for gold inside the city. Spartan culture had no value for gold, even their coins were very heavy iron ones. 3. There are a lot of mistakes on battle. Spartans superiority was not the kung fu style of the movie, but the strong chain of heavy armored warriors (phalanx), unusual or unknown at the time, were one covers with his shield the next in the chain. This tactic with "othismos" (push against the enemy) could break big armies of lone wolfs. This tactic was used and developed further later by Alexander and Romans. 4. Of course they were not naked on battle, but... Generally in Greek armies they were some naked soldiers named "psili" or "gymnites" (same root with word Gymnasium, were athletes were naked). 5. Spartans were naked only before the battle, to wash themselves and fix their hair. They wanted to fight in a celebration 6. Spartan women, against the belief, were possibly the most free women of the era. They had their own property, they had speech on public matters and they had a lot of sports, like javelin and wrestling. If they had too, they could fight in battles and actually they had win, without their men, Pyros, the mighty king of Epirus, who came to conquer Sparta a time where men where in other war! 7. The phrase "Then we shall fight in the shade" is not Hollywood script. It is supposed said by Diinekis as Herodotus wrote. Etc. etc. We were not there, the history was written by Greeks (but not all of them loved Spartans) etc etc The real thing is that this battle, and few more after that, gave to this world something important: The chance to Athenians to build their culture (theatre, drama, history etc) and Democracy so, at least, we have a name for our modern political systems I have a sympathy for Persians, who also gave too much to the world, but I dont personally like pyramid style empires. And of course Xerxes (the great) was not this kind of freak that the movie shows. more about the battle in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Thermopylae Last edited by Yannis; 31st August 2007 at 05:52 PM.

3rd September 2007, 02:11 AM	#7
Bill M Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Georgia Posts: 1,599	KHARTOUM Maybe a few of those Zulu spears found their way up to the Sudan? Grand scale of a movie with Charlton Heston playing General "Chinese" Gordon and -- no kidding -- Sir Lawrence Olivier as the "Mahdi" aka the "Expected One." Quite a few kaskaras and some really good spears. 1966 -- cast of thousands that were not digital! Real guys on camels and horses. Remington rifles. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0060588/ "In this epic tale of the British Army's travails in North Africa, two acting giants appear together for the first and only time: Charlton Heston portrays General Charles "Chinese" Gordon, who in 1883 led the defense of the Sudanese garrison against a Muslim rebellion. And Laurence Olivier plays the instigator of that uprising -- Mahdi, the "spiritual leader" of the Sudan. Robert Ardrey received an Oscar nomination for his screenplay."

31st August 2007, 02:15 AM	#1
Bill M Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Georgia Posts: 1,599	How about "Real Glory?" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0031842/ Moro, kampilan, Barong, Kris, Krag.

3rd September 2007, 12:45 AM	#4
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,854	Great old movie, and is still on VHS. Surprising attention to detail in Moro weapons, though not 100% of the time....so much so that I think many real kampillan and barong may actually be props.

3rd September 2007, 01:27 AM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,348	Oh God, Let's not go there; if that's the case just think about the leftover props from Zulu .

3rd September 2007, 01:54 AM	#6
Bill M Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: USA Georgia Posts: 1,599	The barongs, kris and kampilans did look authentic. There was one VERY shiny kris. But the "Datu" was a Russian actor and carried a Balinese keris. The leader of the Moro was a Japanese actor. He did have a big honking kampilan. But I think they pulled it off rather well. Really liked the movie.

3rd September 2007, 10:07 PM	#8
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,348	Got that one on DVD, also the early version of The Four Feathers; the recent version is junk.