Pamor Staining in the UK?

Pusaka · 8th April 2007, 04:06 PM

Harmful substances are heavily regulated in the UK, you might be able to find someone who will sell you some but it would be probably easer to import it.
I wonder what other substances could be used to etch keris, I think I recall reading that before the use of arsenic a concentrated citric acid from limes etc was heated and the keris blade was placed into the hot liquid to etch.

David · 8th April 2007, 05:02 PM

Arsenic trioxide is heavily regulated in the USA as well, but that doesn't mean there are not ways for the average citizen to obtain it if you put your mind to it.

It would seem to me it would be much easier to find a source within the UK than to try to import a heavily regulated substance into the country.
Limes are still a part of the staining process. It would be interesting to know when arsenic was first used, but it is my understanding that it goes back a ways, giving rise to the early stories that keris blades were poisoned.

Rick · 8th April 2007, 06:46 PM

One could always hunt up some realgar at a mineral shop or on ebay .....

Tim Simmons · 8th April 2007, 07:09 PM

Would gun black work? There is a gunsmith not far from were I live. I have a tombak I would quite like to stain now that I have cleaned it.

David · 8th April 2007, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

Would gun black work? There is a gunsmith not far from were I live. I have a tombak I would quite like to stain now that I have cleaned it.

There are many sustances that will stain the iron of a keris or tombak...however, only arsenic will render it in the "proper" colors when done under the best of curcumstances. So in the end it will depend upon how much you feel obligated to maintaining the piece as it is traditionally supposed to look. For me personally that has some importance. For those who are not as much a stickler for authenticity other substances might do.

A. G. Maisey · 9th April 2007, 03:29 AM

Treasure thy arsenic whilst ye may.

The price of warangan in Solo has gone through the roof. It is still possible to get it done at a reasonable---although greatly elevated---cost, but the result is disgusting. A good job now costs like gold and that is if you can find somebody to do a good job.

Cost of the material has gone up, there is an increasing demand, and import of any type of arsenic has apparently been banned.

I think it will not be too long before sellers are offering blades for sale stained with ferric chloride, and with the option of a warangan stain at an extra cost.

It may well be that in time to come the only places to get a good quality traditional stain could be somewhere in the western world.

Hope I'm wrong, but the current cost of a good stain job is just not realistic, nor sustainable.

David · 9th April 2007, 01:22 PM

Alan, just for a point of reference, could you tell us what the average cost of a good staining actually is these days?

8th April 2007, 04:06 PM	#1
Pusaka Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 341	Harmful substances are heavily regulated in the UK, you might be able to find someone who will sell you some but it would be probably easer to import it. I wonder what other substances could be used to etch keris, I think I recall reading that before the use of arsenic a concentrated citric acid from limes etc was heated and the keris blade was placed into the hot liquid to etch.

8th April 2007, 05:02 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Arsenic trioxide is heavily regulated in the USA as well, but that doesn't mean there are not ways for the average citizen to obtain it if you put your mind to it. It would seem to me it would be much easier to find a source within the UK than to try to import a heavily regulated substance into the country. Limes are still a part of the staining process. It would be interesting to know when arsenic was first used, but it is my understanding that it goes back a ways, giving rise to the early stories that keris blades were poisoned.

8th April 2007, 06:46 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	One could always hunt up some realgar at a mineral shop or on ebay .....

8th April 2007, 07:09 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,843	Would gun black work? There is a gunsmith not far from were I live. I have a tombak I would quite like to stain now that I have cleaned it.

9th April 2007, 03:29 AM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Treasure thy arsenic whilst ye may. The price of warangan in Solo has gone through the roof. It is still possible to get it done at a reasonable---although greatly elevated---cost, but the result is disgusting. A good job now costs like gold and that is if you can find somebody to do a good job. Cost of the material has gone up, there is an increasing demand, and import of any type of arsenic has apparently been banned. I think it will not be too long before sellers are offering blades for sale stained with ferric chloride, and with the option of a warangan stain at an extra cost. It may well be that in time to come the only places to get a good quality traditional stain could be somewhere in the western world. Hope I'm wrong, but the current cost of a good stain job is just not realistic, nor sustainable.

9th April 2007, 01:22 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Alan, just for a point of reference, could you tell us what the average cost of a good staining actually is these days?