African spears. Tourist stuff or genuine weapons?

katana · 5th January 2007, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

It is often said and in good sources that the "lion spear" type did not appear in use untill the very late 19th century. The old form being just as big a spear but a shorter broad leaf blade. Is this also a "lion spear"? One might be able to use it in the same way.

Tim, on that point I'm not certain....but I suspect that it was vitally important that the Lion be incapacitated as quickly as possible.
My assumption is:
The broad leaf head would cause massive damage...but as it travelled deeper into the animal the wound would tend to 'close' around the shaft of the spear. The lion spear, as we know it , having much longer cutting edges would keep the wound more open ...facillitating faster blood loss. Also with the movement of the Lion the sharpened edges would continue to cut and open the wound along the entire length of the 'embedded' spear. This would not happen so well with the leaf shaped head.

A charging Lion is something to behold,..... no I have not seen this 'in the flesh'

But have seen alot of film footage. The Lion sprints and as it reaches its human target leaps and trys to take the victims head in its jaws, as an effective way of 'bringing them down' and yes...their jaws are powerful enough to crush a human skull

In fact, recently in Tanzania a 'Man-eater' was finally killed after it managed to kill 49 know victims......all of those attacked whilst walking/standing had massive head/shoulder trauma cause by the initial attack. Which suggests that the Masai warrior must wait to the last second...to strike the lions underside as it jumps/leaps. Timing and nerves of steel must also be thrown into the equation.

Perhaps the lion spear evolved with this one purpose in mind, improved to quicken the death of a lion .....afterall ...a Lion still 'high' on adrenaline, fatally wounded ...but still alive ...could still 'take you with it'.

I think I am right in saying that only certain groups within the warrior community can carry these, a symbol of bravery. However it also seems that your status is also governed by the size of spear.....the larger the better.

BUT surely the shorter the spear ...the braver you are.....afterall you'd be a lot closer to the lion

katana · 5th January 2007, 09:24 PM

......'and don't mess with the Masai' ...

........'especially if he's fighting a lion! '....
14 January 1961

nKante · 7th January 2007, 10:02 PM

Where can I find video of Maasai hunting lions. I saw a five second b&w clip on TV once. The lion in this particular clip appeared to have the upper hand. He knocked down several warriors. It was very chaotic. I'm sure there were several serious wounds.

ShayanMirza · 8th January 2007, 12:30 AM

My family tradition holds that this was a lion spear. If it isn't, are there any sources of info on its possible region and background? Is it Maasai? Any info would be grand.

katana · 8th January 2007, 04:37 PM

Hi ShayanMirza,
very nice spear.....although I do not think it is Masai...or at least not a typical Masai spear. AFAIK All their spears have 'spiked' butts yours is flared. Overall the features seem to have a Toureg 'flavour'.....
The length and carved raised section put me in mind of a lance used from horseback......but these are just my observations ...I am sure Tim or Lew are better able to ID this.

Flavio · 8th January 2007, 07:29 PM

It's from Congo i think ngbandi

ShayanMirza · 8th January 2007, 08:15 PM

Thank you both a lot for the info! Congo would make sense, since my grandfather acquired it in Belgium when he was stationed there after WWII. Any info on what the Ngbandi used it for? It does remind me of a lance, but AFAIK there wasn't a major tradition of lancing in that region's warfare. Did the Ngbandi have lion spears?

5th January 2007, 09:24 PM	#2
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	......'and don't mess with the Masai' ... ........'especially if he's fighting a lion! '.... 14 January 1961 Attached Images

8th January 2007, 12:30 AM	#4
ShayanMirza Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Charlottesville Posts: 25	My family tradition holds that this was a lion spear. If it isn't, are there any sources of info on its possible region and background? Is it Maasai? Any info would be grand. Attached Images Last edited by ShayanMirza; 8th January 2007 at 12:59 AM.

7th January 2007, 10:02 PM	#3
nKante Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Philly Posts: 72	Where can I find video of Maasai hunting lions. I saw a five second b&w clip on TV once. The lion in this particular clip appeared to have the upper hand. He knocked down several warriors. It was very chaotic. I'm sure there were several serious wounds.

8th January 2007, 04:37 PM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Hi ShayanMirza, very nice spear.....although I do not think it is Masai...or at least not a typical Masai spear. AFAIK All their spears have 'spiked' butts yours is flared. Overall the features seem to have a Toureg 'flavour'..... The length and carved raised section put me in mind of a lance used from horseback......but these are just my observations ...I am sure Tim or Lew are better able to ID this.

8th January 2007, 07:29 PM	#6
Flavio Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Italia Posts: 1,243	It's from Congo i think ngbandi

8th January 2007, 08:15 PM	#7
ShayanMirza Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Charlottesville Posts: 25	Thank you both a lot for the info! Congo would make sense, since my grandfather acquired it in Belgium when he was stationed there after WWII. Any info on what the Ngbandi used it for? It does remind me of a lance, but AFAIK there wasn't a major tradition of lancing in that region's warfare. Did the Ngbandi have lion spears?