Barung(s) for you

mmontoro · 10th February 2005, 04:00 PM

Here's the link to the page advertising the tape:

http://www.kriscutlery.com/sandata/Video/index.html

According to that, the style is a Moro Silat-Kuntaw.

-Beautiful Javanese kris made by a master craftsman - Djeno
-Ilmu power of the Sinar Putih - silat group of Java
-Sali, a Tausug,shows moves of Moro style silat-kuntaw using a kris
-Ado, a Tausug, using a barong
-Watch a swordsmith forge a Moro Kris
And many more!

Rick · 10th February 2005, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mmontoro

Here's the link to the page advertising the tape:

http://www.kriscutlery.com/sandata/Video/index.html

According to that, the style is a Moro Silat-Kuntaw.

-Beautiful Javanese kris made by a master craftsman - Djeno
-Ilmu power of the Sinar Putih - silat group of Java
-Sali, a Tausug,shows moves of Moro style silat-kuntaw using a kris
-Ado, a Tausug, using a barong
-Watch a swordsmith forge a Moro Kris
And many more!

Thanks Manny , I have the tape .

I was fishing for opinions from the fma people here .
Is Silat-Kuntaw a purely Moro form ?
Is what is seen truly Silat-Kuntaw ?

Maybe this subject is a minefield that I should steer clear of .

nechesh · 10th February 2005, 06:26 PM

Gee, and here i thought only the keris threads got went like this.

It seems to me that everyone involved in this thread ought to take a deep breathe and reread the posts they have reacted so strongly to. From my reading i can only conclude that there is either great misunderstanding here or some did not really bother to read some posts through, just reacting to a statement or two they only thought they understood.

MABAGANI · 10th February 2005, 10:00 PM

Tom, sounds like a metaphor to explain faith...like a double ended sword cutting the duality between logic and truth to reveal the unity of reality. Nechesh, passion is a good thing, but mixing it with swords is dangerous...
This thread was supposed to be about barung.
I finally got the barung with the script and symbols, much nicer to handle in person, its long and well balanced, shows good patterning and etch, even delivered with the smell of fragant oils on it. The writing towards the hilt that doesn't show too well in the pics says Allah, its scribed in fine curves opposite the choppy form on the reverse side, the chop type reminds me of the earliest form of Chinese script, seen on bone exhibited at the Asian Art Museum in SF.

Federico · 10th February 2005, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nechesh

Gee, and here i thought only the keris threads got went like this.

Just goes to show you the inter-related nature of the Malay world, Sultanates rubbing off on other Sultanates, collectors rubbing off on other collectors

VANDOO · 11th February 2005, 12:47 AM

WITH RESEARCH YOU FIND AS MANY FACTS, LEGENDS, STORYS AND DATA AS POSSIBLE IF THE ANSWER IS NOT FOUND DUE TO LACK OF INFORMATION YOU CAN TRY AND USE LOGIC TO FILL IN SOME OF THE BLANKS. SOMETIMES IT WORKS AND SOMETIMES IT DOSENT, OFTEN THE FAILURE IS THAT OUR LOGIC IS NOT THE SAME AS THE SOCIETY WE ARE STUDYING. WE MAKE MISTAKES THAT A TRIBAL WARRIOR WOULD NEVER MAKE AS WE DON'T KNOW HIS TABOOS AND BELIEFS.
UNFORTUNATELY THERE HAVE BEEN VERY FEW HUMAN SOCIETYS WHO NEVER HAD A NEED FOR PROTECTION. SOCIETYS HAVE ALWAYS TRAINED THEIR YOUNG MEN AND WOMEN TO COMPETE TO SEE WHO WAS GOOD AT WHAT, TO BEST SERVE THE TRIBE. EARLY TRAINING IS OFTEN LIKE PLAY (SPORTS) OR CEREMONY SUCH AS DANCES AND CONTESTS. WHEN MATURITY WHICH COMES EARLY IN TRIBAL LIFE OCCURS THERE ARE RITUALS AND SUCH AND THESE ARE USED BY THE ELDERS TO STEER THE YOUNG TO WHERE THEY CAN SERVE THE TRIBE BEST. SOME PEOPLE ARE NATURALY BETTER WARRIORS SO THEY WILL BE SENT WITH THE WARRIORS AND RECIEVE MORE FORMAL TRAINING. THOSE THAT ARE NOT AS GOOD MAY BE BETTER AS HUNTERS, BOAT BUILDERS, HUT BUILDERS, ECT.
FIGHTING FORMS AND STYLES NATURALY EVOLVE FROM PREVIOUS TYPES OF WEAPONS TO NEWER ONES WHICH WILL ALSO EVOLVE DIFFERENT TECKNIQUES. YOU CAN USE A STICK OR A SWORD OR KNIFE IN SIMULAR FASHION BUT EACH WILL HAVE DIFFERENT STRENGTHS AND WILL BE BETTER FOR DIFFERENT TYPES OF ATTACK. THE STYLES USED WILL HAVE MUCH THE SAME BASICS BUT MANY MODIFICATIONS AMONG DIFFERENT GROUPS AND AREAS. THESE DIFERENCES ARE OFTEN DUE TO THE SOCIETYS TABOOS (LAWS), SUPERSTITIONS OR WHAT IS CONSIDERED HONORABLE AS THAT OFTEN VARYS WIDELY.
AFTER SEVERAL GENERATIONS OF WARRIORS HAVE USED A WEAPON FOR EXAMPLE BARUNG OR KRIS. THEY WILL HAVE FOUND MANY VARIATIONS THAT WORK BEST TO PASS ON TO STUDENTS OR FAMILY. A STYLE WOULD DEVELOP A VERY LARGE VARIETY OVER THE YEARS, IF THEY FOUGHT SEVERAL DIFFERENT GROUPS OVER A WIDE AREA WITH VARIOUS FIGHTING STYLES AND WEAPONS. THE MORO FIT THIS TO A T AS THEY RAIDED OVER A LARGE AREA AND FOUGHT SEVERAL INVADERS FOR A LONG TIME SO SHOULD HAVE A VERY BROAD MARTIAL ART IF IT HAS NOT BEEN LOST.

11th February 2005, 12:47 AM	#6
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	LOGIC + CONJECTURE = POSSIBLE TRUTH SOMETIMES WITH RESEARCH YOU FIND AS MANY FACTS, LEGENDS, STORYS AND DATA AS POSSIBLE IF THE ANSWER IS NOT FOUND DUE TO LACK OF INFORMATION YOU CAN TRY AND USE LOGIC TO FILL IN SOME OF THE BLANKS. SOMETIMES IT WORKS AND SOMETIMES IT DOSENT, OFTEN THE FAILURE IS THAT OUR LOGIC IS NOT THE SAME AS THE SOCIETY WE ARE STUDYING. WE MAKE MISTAKES THAT A TRIBAL WARRIOR WOULD NEVER MAKE AS WE DON'T KNOW HIS TABOOS AND BELIEFS. UNFORTUNATELY THERE HAVE BEEN VERY FEW HUMAN SOCIETYS WHO NEVER HAD A NEED FOR PROTECTION. SOCIETYS HAVE ALWAYS TRAINED THEIR YOUNG MEN AND WOMEN TO COMPETE TO SEE WHO WAS GOOD AT WHAT, TO BEST SERVE THE TRIBE. EARLY TRAINING IS OFTEN LIKE PLAY (SPORTS) OR CEREMONY SUCH AS DANCES AND CONTESTS. WHEN MATURITY WHICH COMES EARLY IN TRIBAL LIFE OCCURS THERE ARE RITUALS AND SUCH AND THESE ARE USED BY THE ELDERS TO STEER THE YOUNG TO WHERE THEY CAN SERVE THE TRIBE BEST. SOME PEOPLE ARE NATURALY BETTER WARRIORS SO THEY WILL BE SENT WITH THE WARRIORS AND RECIEVE MORE FORMAL TRAINING. THOSE THAT ARE NOT AS GOOD MAY BE BETTER AS HUNTERS, BOAT BUILDERS, HUT BUILDERS, ECT. FIGHTING FORMS AND STYLES NATURALY EVOLVE FROM PREVIOUS TYPES OF WEAPONS TO NEWER ONES WHICH WILL ALSO EVOLVE DIFFERENT TECKNIQUES. YOU CAN USE A STICK OR A SWORD OR KNIFE IN SIMULAR FASHION BUT EACH WILL HAVE DIFFERENT STRENGTHS AND WILL BE BETTER FOR DIFFERENT TYPES OF ATTACK. THE STYLES USED WILL HAVE MUCH THE SAME BASICS BUT MANY MODIFICATIONS AMONG DIFFERENT GROUPS AND AREAS. THESE DIFERENCES ARE OFTEN DUE TO THE SOCIETYS TABOOS (LAWS), SUPERSTITIONS OR WHAT IS CONSIDERED HONORABLE AS THAT OFTEN VARYS WIDELY. AFTER SEVERAL GENERATIONS OF WARRIORS HAVE USED A WEAPON FOR EXAMPLE BARUNG OR KRIS. THEY WILL HAVE FOUND MANY VARIATIONS THAT WORK BEST TO PASS ON TO STUDENTS OR FAMILY. A STYLE WOULD DEVELOP A VERY LARGE VARIETY OVER THE YEARS, IF THEY FOUGHT SEVERAL DIFFERENT GROUPS OVER A WIDE AREA WITH VARIOUS FIGHTING STYLES AND WEAPONS. THE MORO FIT THIS TO A T AS THEY RAIDED OVER A LARGE AREA AND FOUGHT SEVERAL INVADERS FOR A LONG TIME SO SHOULD HAVE A VERY BROAD MARTIAL ART IF IT HAS NOT BEEN LOST. Last edited by VANDOO; 11th February 2005 at 04:51 AM.

10th February 2005, 04:00 PM	#1
mmontoro Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 91	Here's the link to the page advertising the tape: http://www.kriscutlery.com/sandata/Video/index.html According to that, the style is a Moro Silat-Kuntaw. -Beautiful Javanese kris made by a master craftsman - Djeno -Ilmu power of the Sinar Putih - silat group of Java -Sali, a Tausug,shows moves of Moro style silat-kuntaw using a kris -Ado, a Tausug, using a barong -Watch a swordsmith forge a Moro Kris And many more!

10th February 2005, 06:26 PM	#3
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Gee, and here i thought only the keris threads got went like this. It seems to me that everyone involved in this thread ought to take a deep breathe and reread the posts they have reacted so strongly to. From my reading i can only conclude that there is either great misunderstanding here or some did not really bother to read some posts through, just reacting to a statement or two they only thought they understood.

10th February 2005, 10:00 PM	#4
MABAGANI Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 221	Tom, sounds like a metaphor to explain faith...like a double ended sword cutting the duality between logic and truth to reveal the unity of reality. Nechesh, passion is a good thing, but mixing it with swords is dangerous... This thread was supposed to be about barung. I finally got the barung with the script and symbols, much nicer to handle in person, its long and well balanced, shows good patterning and etch, even delivered with the smell of fragant oils on it. The writing towards the hilt that doesn't show too well in the pics says Allah, its scribed in fine curves opposite the choppy form on the reverse side, the chop type reminds me of the earliest form of Chinese script, seen on bone exhibited at the Asian Art Museum in SF.