Fighting with keris

[Kiai Carita]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Thank you for your explanation, Bram.

This is the first time I have heard or read katosan. I understand the root, but to find this word I had to look at five different Javanese dictionaries before I found "katosan" in one of them as a derivative of "atos", and given as a synonym of "kadigdyan", which I think is a fairly commonly used word. Thanks for this knowledge.

You are welcome Alan, I learn new things from you and the members of this forum as well. Katosan - kadigdayan - kanuragan - jaya kawijayann and even sometimes called kanoman - from the word anom (young) meaning usually you learn these things when you are young.

I did not know that Bangau Putih was Kun Tao. My wife was a dedicated practitioner of kun tao in her youth, and has several fairly respected kun tao people in her family, all older people, and located in East Jawa. They still refer to kun tao as kun tao.

Yes, Persatuan Gerak Badan Bangau Putih comes from Pek Ho Pay, based on Chinese White Crane from a Chinese family in Bogor's 'Chinatown'. The older generation still calls it kuntao but as you would know, under $uharto it was 'illegal' to be Chinese.

Your outline of the origins of silat is more or less as I understand it, but I really don`t think we can place a lot of historical credibility on the writings of a popular novelist, no matter how respected he may be. Ever watch "Angling Darmo" or any of the other Indonesian historical soaps? Or for that matter, look at the way popular writers present the history and society of any country. No, I really do feel that we must treat Pramoedya Ananta Toer's work in the way it was intended to be treated.

Easy here Alan, I don't think that Pak Pram (alm) can be compared to the historical soaps which are made without any research. When I was younger I used to visit Pak Pram under house arrest and once he told me that he wrote for Nation Building - he was a Soekarno admirer.

I am familiar with the Kidung Sundayana, and a quick check of my copies does not seem to have any mention of pencak silat. I am not claiming that the version accessed by O'ong Maryono does not mention pencak silat, however, it would be interesting to know what version that was, and what canto within the work. Do you have access to this information?

You are lucky to have Kidung Sundayana, Alan. I read about it in Pencak Silat Merentang Waktu by O'ong Maryono...It is not called silat by the way, rather the word used is ulin - play. It is mentioned in the part describing the Pajajaran King's retinue, there were performances of fighters who would ulin with various weapons. I havn't got O'ongs book at hand though.

Regarding the keris and its capability as a weapon. When we look at an old keris now, we should try to bear in mind that what we usually see is only a shadow of what that keris was when it was new.Examination of early keris that were taken to Europe when those keris were new, or near to it, demonstrates quite conclusively that the types of keris that we are used to regarding as slight and frail, when new, were very serious weapons.I suggest reference to "Den Indonesiske Kris"--Karsten Sejr Jensen--ISSN 0108-707X.

Very interesting, thank you for telling me this.

On the subject of tangguh, one should consider the social reasons for the origin of this system of classification, before attaching too much credibilty to the alignment of any specific tangguh with a historical period.

It always baffled me that there were sophisticated dhapurs in tangguh Jenggala and tangguh Kediri when the reliefs on the candi built by Singasari showed more simple 'primitive' betok types.

Yes, I do understand the reversal of roles that could be applied to Gusti Djuminah, however, the fact remains that the public sources relating to this gentleman indicate that he was at the very least , politically inept. It is obvious that the Dutch could not afford to approve the installation of a traditional lord whose character and attitudes were such that it was feared he could bring economic ruin to the area over which he held control.Under HBVII enormous wealth had flowed into the Yogya area, which benefitted not only HBVII, but also his people, and not least the Dutch. It would appear that many people at that time were afraid that if Gusti Djuminah were to be installed as HBVIII Yogya would suffer economic reversal. The reason he was not installed as HBVIII was because it was believed that his taking of the crown could have resulted in economic ruin for that part of Jawa. His grandson may believe that it was because Gusti Djuminah had an interest in pencak silat, that Gusti Djuminah did not ascend the throne, personally I prefer to accept the historical version rather than the grandson`s version. But we are all free to believe that which we will.

Well, his grandson happens to be one of my Gurus and several of his his great grandchildren are my brothers, so while I understand the Dutch position, I believe the family. After all, the Dutch shouldn't have been there in the first place. Since the beginning Ngayogyakarta Hadiningrat had an anti-colonial streak to it. An other of my Guru, the poet Rendra, comes from the Suryoningalaga house of Yogyakarta. His father was a silat teacher in the kraton before he had an argument with the Suktan and he moved to Solo.

Just as an aside:- it really does assist in understanding what occurred in Jawa, and the rest of the old Dutch East Indies, under the Dutch, if one adopts the attitude of an accountant. Every single action that involved the Dutch in the Indies, following the bankruptcy in 1798 of the VOC, and the assumption of its role by the Dutch Government, was the product of a bureaucratic philosophy administered by accountants. The Dutch were very good accountants.

So true, something to always remember.

This ongoing question of handle position on a Central Javanese keris is easily understood if the keris is held correctly. The blade is pinched between thumb and forefinger,at the blumbangan, and the first joint of the index finger is anchored against the gonjo, the middle finger, ring finger, and little finger lightly touch the handle but have only a guide and balance role. Held in this way, there is no pressure on the handle at all, it simply acts as an aid to blade orientation. The handle is used to draw the keris, and to replace it, but if the keris is to be used, it is not held by the handle, but by the method described above. The essence of keris use is that it must be very, very fast. Ideally so fast that the blade is not seen. Try holding a keris as I have described and see how very much faster this is than gripping it by the handle. A Javanese keris gripped by the handle really feels very clumsy and "dead".

I tried this, problem was then that I did not have the strength to stab, could easily slip and cut my hand. I think the Sumatra - Malay way of positioning the ukiran is the 'correct' way to have it if the keris is to be used to fight. That way it is like a pistol grip and you can stab as hard as you like without the risk of your hand slipping.

Thanks for the dialogue I really appreciate it.

Hormat saya,
Bram.

[A. G. Maisey]

Oh, I see, "play" rather than "pencak silat".

Yes, that is understandable. There is mention of keris play in the Pararaton too.However, the translation of "ulin" as "play" has me puzzled. In Old Javanese "ulin" has a couple of different meanings, but "play" is not one of them. The closest we can get to play is probably "wave", or "hold up".Still I guess that depending on the context, one of these meanings might be able to be stretched to "play".

Regarding the keris grip. It does work, some years back when I had an interest in the more bloody aspects of keris study I was taught how to hold and use a keris in this way. It would be difficult to use an old, worn keris like this, because the narrowness of the top of the gonjo will bite into the index finger, but with a keris that provides sufficient support for the index finger, this grip works beautifully.In fact, held correctly in this way, the keris locks itself into your hand.There is absolutely no risk of your hand slipping down the blade, because that blade is locked against the base of the index finger.

[Boedhi Adhitya]

Dear Kyai Carita,

As I'm mostly handling the Jogja's style handles, which are very probably the smallest style of keris' handles, I suggest a slightly different/modified way of (Javanese) keris handles gripping. I, and most experienced keris's lover here in Jogja as I observed, pinched the end of mendhak where it meets ganja (very much likely as you pinch your steak knife). The end of the handle should rest firmly on the lower part/base of your palm, and other fingers (that are, your middle, ring, and little fingers) should keep the handle that ways. In this way, your elbow, forearm and pesi should make a straight line (in 'ready-to-stab' position) while the tip/point of angled blade should resemble your (now curled) index finger. You may employ this method just before you draw your keris, as the proper way to draw the Javanese keris is to push the 'thorn' part of wrangka with your thumb. If you are right handed, the gandhik should face left and the buntut urang/'tail' should protect your outer side of the hand. It is suggested that you held the keris at waist height, and strike only the opponent's abdoment or heart, by pushing the keris with your palm. If the keris where made and handled properly, it's handling would be very firm and as natural as pointing and thrusting with your index finger. It is, as Alan said, a serious (and deadly) weapons. Despite it's 'clumsy' appearance, it has been proven to be very functional and ergonomic as a stabbing weapon. IMHO, that's why other area outside Java (while many expert believe, Java is the home of keris) adopt the keris as one of their personal 'arsenal', despite their own 'indigenous' weapons such as Badik or Rencong which roughly are the same 'class'.
Pinching blumbangan/pejetan, as Alan suggested, would certainly works and very fine too, but it may stained your blade (something you wouldn't consider in the face of enemy, I believe). Handling and drawing the keris as the same as golok would show instantly (in Java) that the handler is inexperience. Please remind, the Javanese handles are gauged for Javanese, which, I believe, has smaller hand/palm than Caucasian, in general.

About the handle position of Javanese keris, it is already 'battle ready' as it is. No need to change it to an angled position such as Malay/Bugis handle. It just need a firm and proper fitting. No gap allowed between the ganja, mendhak and handle. It is recommended to use shellac to mount the handle to give it firm fit, If you consider to use it as a weapon. I should tell you, contrary to common belief to mount keris handle with hair in old days, ALL Jogjakarta Court and their very immediate families' keris handles are shellaced. Hair and cloth seems to be used by commoners.

About the poisons,..
Well, as Alan said, warangan mainly composed of Arsenic, which is a 'slow poison', unless you take it a teaspoonfull. Proper method of 'marangi' would only leave a small amount of it on the blade (I'm not saying none!), which, I believe, not capable of poisoning someone to death in hours. It may have some effect, such as a long healing wound, but will not kill you instantly or in hours. I don't know the effect of other poisoning methods already mentioned. While it is written in Ensiklopedi Keris, I have never met,heard or found someone here in Jogja practising the 'Cacab/Cem-ceman' method. I suggest someone give it a try (to mice or other creatures, if you have a heart, and not human or fellow forumities certainly), and I would love to hear the result
Another way of making the blade poisonous by villagers in marangi process include coating the blade with over-saturated warangan solutions (usually the white, low grade, cheap one) and to let it dry under the sun without cleaned it first. The result is the blade covered with warangan powder, which is not only ugly and dirty, but may corroded the blade as the acid wasn't cleaned properly. Rust may occurs in several days. Don't do it at home, please.

About the 'poisoning' effect of keris or tombak, Harimurti AKA Ndoro Hari, the son of Prince Tejokusuma HB VII (as already mentioned by Kiai Carita as a famous Pendekar of Jogjakarta) had a story, which is quoted in a book dedicated to him, written by one of his students, S. Lumintu (and then quoted by me ): When Ndoro Hari was young, he used to follow the close 'free-fight-championship' followed by many pendekars, and only pendekar allowed. It was a very deadly championship, as 'free' means 'free', you may use any method and any weapons you wish. The death result, was very common. One day, Ndoro Hari must fought against pendekar which use a tombak pusaka as his weapon. Ndoro Hari saw as if there was a flame covering the tombak. He knew, it was a deadly tombak. At the end of the fight, Ndoro Hari, who used no weapon, managed to catch the tombak under his armpit and step on the wooden shaft and broke it, and thus succesfully defeat his opponent. Unfortunately, when he caught the tombak, it left a minor cut on his waist. Just after the fight, he felt he lost his strength, and the cut felt like burning. He asked his companion to brought him to a Kyai who was his teacher in Ngawi quickly, which was several hours away (Ndoro Hari had many teachers. He wandered Java to learn pencak silat). Reaching Ngawi, Ndoro Hari was already weak, he couldn't walk by himself. His teacher quickly helped him. 'If only you are late for an hour or two, your life couldn't be saved,' the Kyai said.

A flame covering the spear point or keris, is quite 'common' reported. But it could only happen in a very serious situation, when the bearer very intended and determined to use the pusaka as a weapons. One cannot turn it 'on' and 'off' as if it is a flashlight. Belief it or not belief it, one should be very careful with such a weapons, or any weapons.

Keris in general has many functions and aspects, which developed through times. IMHO, one function don't necessarily erased anothers. It only add another dimension. But if we discuss a single specific blade, we may discuss what dimension this specific blade belongs to. Was it intended by the maker as a weapon, as a social-class attribute, as a talismanic device, as just a daily clothing accessories or other functions ? One specific blade could serve more than one function, and very limited ones were intended by the maker to serve all aspects/functions.

Alan,
Sorry for 'repeating' your post. I 99% agree with you. I save the 1% for future use

David,
Yes, I owe you a new keyboard. I do owe many keyboards and apologize to the forumities who incidently 'broke their keyboard' by one or other reasons, after reading my previous post

Best regards,

Boedhi Adhitya

[A. G. Maisey]

Pak boedhi, do me a favour:- please don`t hit me with that 1%.

1% , well directed and pushed hard , can kill.

Your remarks on the dimensions, or facets, of a keris are very fitting. This is something that is often overlooked.

[drdavid]

Hi all
for what it is worth, I was just re-reading Mr Maisey's post on gripping the keris and it struck me as I was trying it out how similar it is to the way I recall being taught to handle a fencing foil (admittedly it is 25 years since I did any fencing but a firm smack with a foil on your calf from the old Hungarian master has a way of imprinting things). The fencing grip (unless you are using a modern custom moulded handpiece) is all thumb and index finger with the other fingers providing only the lightest of control on the hilt, angling the wrist provided a lot of the change in attack. Of course the fencing foil (and epee) can only score with the tip much as a keris could only 'score' with the point. A foil has the advantage of length over a keris but a keris (even in its heavily worn state) has the advantage of bulk over a foil.
cheers
DrD

[A. G. Maisey]

Several people have asked me for a photo of the grip I describe.

Here you have two.

[Georgia]

Hi all
I'm really grateful for this forum, what a fantastic resource!
I just wanted to go back to the issue of arsenic residues remaining on blades, and their potential toxicity. I'm currently working on a project about keris in public collections for my masters degree in conservation, and as part of this I recently tested nine blades in an Australian museum's collection for the presence of arsenic. Having discussed the project with Alan Maisey previously, and understanding that the staining process (when done properly) should not result in any free arsenic remaining on the blade's surface, I did not really expect much from these tests, however all tested positive, with two having particularly strong results, up to 0.35mg/L (the Merck test I used requires the sample to be dissolved/suspended in water). While it would be difficult for any staff handling these objects to inhale, ingest, or absorb a signifcant amount of the residue, it is certainly present in sufficient amounts to cause adverse health effects. However, the World Heath Organisation states in its arsenic safety guide (http://www.inchem.org/documents/hsg/...tionNumber:2.6) "In man, the smallest recorded fatal dose is in the range of 70-180 mg, but recovery has been reported after much larger doses" - this suggests that for it to work effectively as a poison on a keris blade, there would have to be much more residue on the surface than would result from staining with warangan.
Raffles' wrote in his History of Java "it is usual to immerse the blade in lime juice and a solution of arsenic, which, by eating away and corroding the iron, may probably render the wound more angry and inflamed, and consequently more difficult to cure, but it has never been considered that death is the consequence." (vol. 1 p. 352) ... I reckon it would depend on where the wound is!