Certain “Indian” swords and their relation to the Afghan Shashkas

Jim McDougall · 2nd March 2024, 03:30 AM

Not at all, the down turned quillons are basically from Qajar Persia, along with the stylized dragon/etc quillon terminals. Persia was a primary influence throughout Afghanistan, Northern India, Sind.

Which brings back these curious 'shashka type' sabers, which have nothing to do with S.India. What source has said these are of South Indian provenance?
As previously noted, the 'paluoar' is a form of tulwar characteristically associated with Afghanistan, which was essentially part of Northern India's 'Northwest Frontier' through the 19th c.

Keep in mind that Persia and the Ottomans had key influences on weapons of India, which as noted included Afghan areas. Afghan weaponry reflected those influences just as India, and was not an influence overall on Indian weapons . I would recommend "Hindu Arms and Ritual" , Robert Elgood for excellent coverage on these topics.

kai · 5th March 2024, 08:59 PM

Dear all,

Aside from kinda vague pommel similarities obviously based on ergonomics (and a ferrule/bolster style much more widespread including e.g. Indonesia), I fail to see any close relationship between these 2 groups of blades, I'm afraid. It isn't even established whether their suspected age range overlaps to any significant degree (and happens to be consistent with any suggested cultural connections).

There is quite a bit of variability among the southern Indian blades: Some more examples have been discussed here:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=991

Regards,
Kai

2nd March 2024, 03:30 AM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,191	Not at all, the down turned quillons are basically from Qajar Persia, along with the stylized dragon/etc quillon terminals. Persia was a primary influence throughout Afghanistan, Northern India, Sind. Which brings back these curious 'shashka type' sabers, which have nothing to do with S.India. What source has said these are of South Indian provenance? As previously noted, the 'paluoar' is a form of tulwar characteristically associated with Afghanistan, which was essentially part of Northern India's 'Northwest Frontier' through the 19th c. Keep in mind that Persia and the Ottomans had key influences on weapons of India, which as noted included Afghan areas. Afghan weaponry reflected those influences just as India, and was not an influence overall on Indian weapons . I would recommend "Hindu Arms and Ritual" , Robert Elgood for excellent coverage on these topics.

5th March 2024, 08:59 PM	#2
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Dear all, Aside from kinda vague pommel similarities obviously based on ergonomics (and a ferrule/bolster style much more widespread including e.g. Indonesia), I fail to see any close relationship between these 2 groups of blades, I'm afraid. It isn't even established whether their suspected age range overlaps to any significant degree (and happens to be consistent with any suggested cultural connections). There is quite a bit of variability among the southern Indian blades: Some more examples have been discussed here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=991 Regards, Kai