Tulwar hilt and disc pommel.....the reason for their design

S.Al-Anizi · 3rd July 2006, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jens Nordlunde

If you really are interested in the subject, you should go back, looking for signs, when the tulwar hilt started to look like it has for several hundreds of years, and why you are at it, you should also take an interest in the very early hilts. Maybe this will tell you more than watching the video clips. Although they are interesting, and the movements very elegant, they are hardly fighting technique.

I must agree with you Jens, this looks more like dancing and stage fighting swordplay rather than fighting techniques, pretty much like the Syrian "hakam" sword dancing we saw a long time ago on SFI.

katana · 3rd July 2006, 03:21 PM

In my experience of Martial Arts, whether with weapons or not, stylised routines were developed which incorperated 'moves' and techniques. These are generally know as 'forms'.
Many of the 'forms' seem little more than a sequence of movement: however ....this is usually far from the truth.
What I see is fast coordination between body movement and sword movement, the practice of deadly slashing cuts....this is the function of the 'dance', obviously you would not run into the battle field and then re-enact it.....this is practice ...in fluid movement.
The movements may seem dance-like but it develops balance, coordination and technique.............. this concept is well understood by many Eastern cultures and practioners of their Martial Arts in the West.

Rick · 3rd July 2006, 03:26 PM

I caught a glimpses of a very functional thrust, parries and draw cuts from those vids .
The rest , possibly some elements of positioning for the strike ; most everything else seemed like frosting on the cake .

katana · 3rd July 2006, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

I caught a glimpses of a very functional thrust, parries and draw cuts from those vids .
The rest , possibly some elements of positioning for the strike ; most everything else seemed like frosting on the cake .

......or perhaps evasive manoeuvres...

Rick · 3rd July 2006, 04:52 PM

Yes possibly those too ; but the whirling blade business .

Jens Nordlunde · 3rd July 2006, 05:28 PM

My personal opinion is, that when clips like the these are shown, one should write that this is a kind of dance and not how they fought at the time. On the forum there are new as well as old collectors, and the new collectors may not be able to look what is behind these clips – they make take them for real.

Tim Simmons · 3rd July 2006, 09:28 PM

This is most impressive, a beautiful show of sword play. Some of the clips bring to mind the historic axe swing in the lines of the Saxons at Senlac Hill.

The foot work is a little static for a true dance, certainly for actual sport fencing which can at times be an approximation to a duel or fighting swordsmanship. None the less very skillful and the fact that these clips show thier hands are very familiar with the sword says enough.

3rd July 2006, 09:28 PM	#7
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,842	This is most impressive, a beautiful show of sword play. Some of the clips bring to mind the historic axe swing in the lines of the Saxons at Senlac Hill. The foot work is a little static for a true dance, certainly for actual sport fencing which can at times be an approximation to a duel or fighting swordsmanship. None the less very skillful and the fact that these clips show thier hands are very familiar with the sword says enough. Last edited by Tim Simmons; 3rd July 2006 at 09:55 PM.

3rd July 2006, 03:21 PM	#2
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	In my experience of Martial Arts, whether with weapons or not, stylised routines were developed which incorperated 'moves' and techniques. These are generally know as 'forms'. Many of the 'forms' seem little more than a sequence of movement: however ....this is usually far from the truth. What I see is fast coordination between body movement and sword movement, the practice of deadly slashing cuts....this is the function of the 'dance', obviously you would not run into the battle field and then re-enact it.....this is practice ...in fluid movement. The movements may seem dance-like but it develops balance, coordination and technique.............. this concept is well understood by many Eastern cultures and practioners of their Martial Arts in the West.

3rd July 2006, 03:26 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	I caught a glimpses of a very functional thrust, parries and draw cuts from those vids . The rest , possibly some elements of positioning for the strike ; most everything else seemed like frosting on the cake .

3rd July 2006, 04:52 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	Yes possibly those too ; but the whirling blade business .

3rd July 2006, 05:28 PM	#6
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	My personal opinion is, that when clips like the these are shown, one should write that this is a kind of dance and not how they fought at the time. On the forum there are new as well as old collectors, and the new collectors may not be able to look what is behind these clips – they make take them for real.