Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Keris Warung Kopi
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 9th June 2023, 12:50 PM   #1
Gustav
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
Default

Detlef, thank you for posting it, without doubt it is a valuable reference.

Do you have information on who did the Wrongko and painting?
Gustav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th June 2023, 02:04 PM   #2
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 7,043
Default

You are absolutely right about Dietrich, Detlef.

There would perhaps not have been a keris renaissance had it not been for the involvement of Dietrich.

The story I have is that there was an article published, probably in a German publication that told of Djeno & his brothers who were descendants of one of the last keris makers in Jawa. Dietrich learnt of their existence from this, and then set out to find them.

In 1972 when Dietrich located them he then encouraged them to begin making keris again. Dietrich himself had a lot of theoretical knowledge about pattern welding and he passed this on to Djeno & his brothers. This story came from an American who was also involved in the early days of the revival.

The story I have from a number of Javanese informants is that Dietrich never stopped trying to pass his understandings to Javanese craftsmen. He was unceasingly enthusiastic about informing & advising the pandes he came in contact with.

These are stories. I have them from other people, American & Javanese, I do not know how accurate they are. But it is certain that Dietrich was the catalyst that brought Javanese keris manufacture back to life, everything else flowed from that point.

I have seen five or six keris made by Djeno, several of these were keris that were ordered by various people and that I was asked to collect for them. One was for a gentleman from Malaysia, the others were for people in Europe and one (?) for a gentleman in USA.

Then there is the story of a Canadian professor who ordered a keris from Djeno, & made the mistake of bargaining on the price. He paid the reduced price agreed to after negotiation, Djeno completed the keris & sent it to him. When it arrived in Canada it had a big hole drilled right through the middle. It seems to me --- and to the buyer --- that Djeno removed a part of the finished keris to compensate for the lower price.

Although Dietrich & Djeno are the widely known & acknowledged beginning, there were at least two other people who had made keris in Jawa after the end of WWII and before Djeno began making keris again.

However, Garrett & Bronwen Solyom must not be forgotten. Had it not been for their enthusiasm and efforts in promotion of an understanding of the Javanese keris by way of the exhibition (1978?) at the East-West Center in Hawaii & the catalogue that was published in conjunction with this exhibition ("The World of the Javanese Keris"), the flame that Dietrich lit might have sputtered & died.

Garrett & Bronwen first became aware of the keris in about 1966 and immediately identified this Javanese cultural icon as a fertile field for further research. Garrett's mentor was Panembahan Harjonegoro (Alm.) (at that time his rank was Raden Tumenggung) who was a member of the family that provided the bupatis for Boyolali, he went to school with the man who later became PBXII, & they were life-long friends. Harjonegoro was also instrumental in the support of the keris renaissance.

Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 9th June 2023 at 10:06 PM. Reason: replace word
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2023, 01:39 AM   #3
JustYS
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 146
Default

Other Keris collection of Dietrich Drescher:

https://ificah-blog.com/dietrich-dreschers-collection/
JustYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2023, 04:34 AM   #4
Anthony G.
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 470
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustYS View Post
Other Keris collection of Dietrich Drescher:

https://ificah-blog.com/dietrich-dreschers-collection/
Hi

Thank you for sharing, these are awesome works
Anthony G. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2023, 07:27 AM   #5
JustYS
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 146
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony G. View Post
Hi

Thank you for sharing, these are awesome works
You are welcome Anthony.

Those Keris were made by Mr(s) Jeno, Joso, Haji Duraphik, Subandi, Suyanto and Yantono.

The first two are known Empu from Yogya, the last three I believe what Alan called “Anak-anak ASKI”.

Haji Duraphik, I’m not sure but probably from Madura.
JustYS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2023, 10:05 AM   #6
Gustav
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
Default

I can understand quite well a blade in Ngentho-Entho style is esthetically very far away from Surakarta canon, and this blade is a textbook Ngentho-Entho, a very good one at that.

It is also not mine favorite blade style, but I very much appreciate the coherent, clear stylistic idiom this blade embodies, together with the surface workmanship and a nearly perfect distribution of Pamor over the body of blade, on both sides. This blade really is alive, a true Keris.

On Keris renaissance and Jitar. For the years starting with 1973 until beginning of 80ties the more important of the brothers, head of the family, and one can say, the true master, also in quality of Keris making, was Yosopangarso. Of course they all worked together, but Yosopangarso left his character on blades they produced, an old style Javanese person. No wonder Keris making process Solyoms documented was done by Yosopangarso. Later Djeno started his own thing and was clearly more interested and talented in promoting his work.

Sadly even some of these early blades, which sometimes are almost impeccable, are now known as made by Djeno. This is a very good example for how a later fame overwrites and changes the past.

Last edited by Gustav; 10th June 2023 at 10:24 AM.
Gustav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2023, 03:03 PM   #7
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 7,043
Default

There is more than a little bit of confusion and variation in reporting of the early years of the keris revival.

How many brothers did Djeno have?

Were all of them smiths?

How many Yosopangarsos were there? One, or two? Did one die in 1940?

Was the Yosopangarso who worked with Djeno through the 1970's his elder brother, or his uncle?

Was the keris produced in 1974 really the first keris that Djeno was involved in the production of, or was it the one that Djeno & his father (Empu Supowinangun) made in 1945?

Whoever the Jitar Yoso was, he was hierarchically superior to Djeno, and thus it became his responsibility to perform the rites attached to production of a keris, even though both Yoso & Djeno worked together on both Dietrich's 1974 keris and Garrett's 1976 keris.

It would appear that prior to the involvement of Dietrich, none of the Djeno family were actually working as smiths, it was Dietrich who got them up & working with fire & iron again.

However, be the back story what it may --- and there is a lot more to this back story that must remain unreported --- the fact is it was Djeno who was the active member of the clan & the driving force.

I do not believe that keris literate people have forgotten Yoso or the other people involved, its just that Djeno was around for a lot longer, made many more keris, and got a lot more publicity than anybody else.

The full story behind the 1976 keris is one that will never be told, but if it ever were to be told, a lot of myths would be blown away with the wind.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2023, 08:33 AM   #8
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 9,267
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post
Detlef, thank you for posting it, without doubt it is a valuable reference.

Do you have information on who did the Wrongko and painting?
My enjoy Gustav! My memory is stated in #3 but it's just my memory.

Regards,
Detlef
Sajen is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2023, 09:11 AM   #9
Gustav
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
Default

Alan, I completely agree, without Dietrich Drescher Ki Yoso and Ki Djeno wouldn't start to make Keris again.

I very well am aware of the meaning of the name Yosocurigo. With family lineage I meant the lineage of Empu family.

I am not sure this name was given by Kraton Jogja. There is a misconception Supowinangun was Empu of Kraton - he wasn't, he was Empu of Kepatihan and his sons were Empu by family descent. I know of no rank given to Yoso by Kraton.

We all know Pak Jimmy very well.

The American - was he sporadically contributing to this Forum a time ago?
Gustav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2023, 09:45 AM   #10
A. G. Maisey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 7,043
Default

With the Yoso name, its as I said, he could have got it from anywhere, but it is not a family name, it is a professional name.

I seem to recall there was a split between Djeno's father & the kraton, & Djeno's "empu" designation was a popular one not from HB. I forget all the details of this, probably knew it once, but I've just about used up all the keris space available in my head. I guess a hereditary title makes sense in some sort of way, can't say I've heard of this, but I suppose it could happen.

My understanding of the "empu" or "mpu" designation is that it is an honorific of respect given by a ruler to a notable person, usually an armourer or a literary person. In the old days its use was more widespread and was just an honorific used for anybody notable for whatever reason.

However, it was/is possible for somebody to acquire the designation "empu" by popular acclaim. For example Pauzan Pusposukadgo was always referred to as empu, but although he was a part of the Surakarta hierarchy he would not accept the designation of "empu" from the kraton, his understanding of an empu was that an empu was able to bring life into a keris, and his strong religious faith made the very idea of this abhorrent.

Pauzan's preferred designation was "Pande Seni Keris".

We all might know "Pak Jimmy", but I'm afraid I cannot place the name, I might know him by some other name, but again, its as I said:- if he has written & published about keris I've probably read his writings.

The American gentleman to whom I referred has never --- to the best of my knowledge --- taken part in any online discussion of any kind, I regard him & his wife as good friends, but he keeps himself to himself.
A. G. Maisey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2023, 04:32 PM   #11
Gustav
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,295
Default

Alan, I failed to express myself again, but the matter isn't of so big importance.

I understand now whom you do mean, thank you.

Last edited by Gustav; 11th June 2023 at 06:09 PM.
Gustav is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.