Unusual Sumatran sword, maybe Mandailing?

VVV · 16th August 2007, 11:14 PM

This tricky sword maybe some of you recognise from the Baltimore show?
I got it from Artzi and promised to share whatever I could find out about it on the forum.
My first impression was that it probably was from the Moluccas.
The blade looks a bit like Tanimbar and the hilt like those sometimes seen on swords from Buru and Obi.
But the quality is much better as well as the motifs didn't match that region.
I discussed it with Arjan who gave me the idea that it maybe could be Sumatran.
After some more research I think it probably is Mandailing.
That based on some related features on the few Mandailing blades I found in the Leiden archives (f.i. 769-23), as well as the motifs on this sword.
The Mandailing tribe are probably ex-Batak, but became Muslim quite early.
Here is a nice site about this people and some old pictures http://www.mandailing.org/Eng/indexeng.html

Michael

Dajak · 16th August 2007, 11:35 PM

Hi Michael it looks to me more an malay / borneo influence weapon

can you make an close up just below the hilt off the carving

I did see similar blade in the depot off an museum but no handle on it

Ben

VVV · 17th August 2007, 12:21 AM

Hi Ben,

Here you are.
Have you checked Leiden 769-23?
Do you have any pictures or references of the blade you had in mind from Borneo?
Was it a Parang Bedak blade without a hilt?

Michael

RSWORD · 17th August 2007, 03:16 AM

Michael,

Yes, a few of us did get the opportunity to see and handle this beaut at the Baltimore show. It is really a lovely piece and one of superior quality throughout.

Dajak · 17th August 2007, 09:14 AM

Hi Michael is that an coin under the handle we see this a lot in Borneo the motif under the handle I never did see that used in Sumatra .
I will go back to the museum as soon as I have time to make an full picture.

If you visit the Netherlands I can take you to this museum depot that closed in 2004 .
It has an old collection never see weapons like it before.

VVV · 17th August 2007, 09:28 AM

Rick and Ben,

Yes this sword has a very nice weapon feeling.

Ben, no coin under the handle on mine as sometimes found on the Dayak parang.
Which one on the picture has common features like my sword?
The motif is found in f.i. Aceh aka three intertwined ropes (see f.i. B Leigh p. 82)
Thanks for the invitation to visit the museum depot with you as well as eat some good Surinam food.
I e-mail you when I find a date to come down to Holland.

Michael

Dajak · 17th August 2007, 10:08 AM

Hi Michael the one in the front with out the handle has same blade shape .
And yes youre also invited also to eat some Surinaams food .

Ben

VVV · 17th August 2007, 10:19 AM

Hi Ben,

To see the blade shape of that sword for me is just as difficult as for you to see that it isn't a coin under the hilt - pictures you know...

I can't see the characteristic protrusions close to the hilt or the form of the tip.
Do you have more pictures of it or should we have a close look when I visit you?

Michael

Dajak · 17th August 2007, 10:42 AM

Hi Michael we take a look when you are coming it is better to have it in the hand you have an close look at it .

Ben

Battara · 17th August 2007, 07:46 PM

I must admit I do love the superb artistic engraving on that blade - very time consuming and expensive work - someone important owned that puppy!

VVV · 17th August 2007, 10:53 PM

Yes,

I haven't seen that much engraving before on a sword like this.

Michael

milandro · 24th March 2023, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVV

Yes,

I haven't seen that much engraving before on a sword like this.

Michael

Hello Have you perhaps seen my similar sword in this thread?

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=28645

kai · 24th March 2023, 04:02 PM

Hello André,

Note that this is a very early thread - more examples have surfaced since.

Thanks for reminding me to add more to the other thread...

Regards,
Kai

milandro · 24th March 2023, 07:36 PM

Cheers Kai,

nice to her I have only found the one mentioned in this thread + the ones in my thread (where you show one from Maurits ).

If you come across more I'd like to see them

milandro · 10th April 2023, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

Hello André,

Note that this is a very early thread - more examples have surfaced since.

Thanks for reminding me to add more to the other thread...

Regards,
Kai

I am still looking for other examples of these style of weapons, so far the only examples I have seen are 3 ( mine and other two) mentioned in this and my thread but I would love to see more

16th August 2007, 11:14 PM	#1
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Unusual Sumatran sword, maybe Mandailing? This tricky sword maybe some of you recognise from the Baltimore show? I got it from Artzi and promised to share whatever I could find out about it on the forum. My first impression was that it probably was from the Moluccas. The blade looks a bit like Tanimbar and the hilt like those sometimes seen on swords from Buru and Obi. But the quality is much better as well as the motifs didn't match that region. I discussed it with Arjan who gave me the idea that it maybe could be Sumatran. After some more research I think it probably is Mandailing. That based on some related features on the few Mandailing blades I found in the Leiden archives (f.i. 769-23), as well as the motifs on this sword. The Mandailing tribe are probably ex-Batak, but became Muslim quite early. Here is a nice site about this people and some old pictures http://www.mandailing.org/Eng/indexeng.html Michael Attached Images Last edited by VVV; 16th August 2007 at 11:31 PM. Reason: added two old pictures

17th August 2007, 12:21 AM	#3
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Ben, Here you are. Have you checked Leiden 769-23? Do you have any pictures or references of the blade you had in mind from Borneo? Was it a Parang Bedak blade without a hilt? Michael Attached Images Last edited by VVV; 17th August 2007 at 12:32 AM.

17th August 2007, 09:14 AM	#5
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Michael is that an coin under the handle we see this a lot in Borneo the motif under the handle I never did see that used in Sumatra . I will go back to the museum as soon as I have time to make an full picture. If you visit the Netherlands I can take you to this museum depot that closed in 2004 . It has an old collection never see weapons like it before. Attached Images

16th August 2007, 11:35 PM	#2
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Michael it looks to me more an malay / borneo influence weapon can you make an close up just below the hilt off the carving I did see similar blade in the depot off an museum but no handle on it Ben

17th August 2007, 03:16 AM	#4
RSWORD Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 1,083	Michael, Yes, a few of us did get the opportunity to see and handle this beaut at the Baltimore show. It is really a lovely piece and one of superior quality throughout.

17th August 2007, 09:28 AM	#6
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Rick and Ben, Yes this sword has a very nice weapon feeling. Ben, no coin under the handle on mine as sometimes found on the Dayak parang. Which one on the picture has common features like my sword? The motif is found in f.i. Aceh aka three intertwined ropes (see f.i. B Leigh p. 82) Thanks for the invitation to visit the museum depot with you as well as eat some good Surinam food. I e-mail you when I find a date to come down to Holland. Michael

17th August 2007, 10:08 AM	#7
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Michael the one in the front with out the handle has same blade shape . And yes youre also invited also to eat some Surinaams food . Ben

17th August 2007, 10:19 AM	#8
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Ben, To see the blade shape of that sword for me is just as difficult as for you to see that it isn't a coin under the hilt - pictures you know... I can't see the characteristic protrusions close to the hilt or the form of the tip. Do you have more pictures of it or should we have a close look when I visit you? Michael

17th August 2007, 10:42 AM	#9
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi Michael we take a look when you are coming it is better to have it in the hand you have an close look at it . Ben

17th August 2007, 07:46 PM	#10
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	I must admit I do love the superb artistic engraving on that blade - very time consuming and expensive work - someone important owned that puppy!

17th August 2007, 10:53 PM	#11
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Yes, I haven't seen that much engraving before on a sword like this. Michael

24th March 2023, 04:02 PM	#13
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,254	Hello André, Note that this is a very early thread - more examples have surfaced since. Thanks for reminding me to add more to the other thread... Regards, Kai

24th March 2023, 07:36 PM	#14
milandro Member Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Netherlands Posts: 475	Cheers Kai, nice to her I have only found the one mentioned in this thread + the ones in my thread (where you show one from Maurits ). If you come across more I'd like to see them