Safavid or qajar blade?

Drabant1701 · 23rd April 2022, 04:45 PM

"Thus, the secrets of wootz are still undiscovered, but who needs them? Modern metallurgy produces iron alloys of unquestionably superior quality."

Back when I started collecting I bought only eropean and american arms, but after seeing wootz for the first time its been all oriental arms. I never ge3t tired of looking at a nice wootz blade

And when I have your atention Ariel, I have this sword with an unmarked wootz blade, its my favorite wootz in my collection and its mounted on indian mounts but I do think the blade is persian. What do you think looking att the wootz in the picture below. Also here is a terrible movie of it https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/702399107

ariel · 23rd April 2022, 10:15 PM

Very, very, very nice!
To distinguish between Indian and Persian manufacture one needs a lot of luck ( Indian masters learned Persian technique sometimes in the 17th century and there were real Persian bladesmiths at the Mughal court and, likely, some private ones too), picture of the entire sword and another one focused at the part of the blade near the handle.

Drabant1701 · 24th April 2022, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Very, very, very nice!
To distinguish between Indian and Persian manufacture one needs a lot of luck ( Indian masters learned Persian technique sometimes in the 17th century and there were real Persian bladesmiths at the Mughal court and, likely, some private ones too), picture of the entire sword and another one focused at the part of the blade near the handle.

Here are more pictures. This blade differs from my other shamshir blades, my other shamshir blades have straight sides but this is curved inwards (hard to explain I made a picture).

ariel · 24th April 2022, 06:02 PM

The blade is highly curved and tapering down to a very sharp tip.
There is no “ indian ricasso”, ie an unsharpened part of the blade adjacent to the quillon block.

Both of them together tell us this blade’s fashion ( and,-highly likely,- its origin): Persia.

Suggest contacting Jens Nordlunde and check whether he still has a copy of his book “A passion for Indian arms”. If you read it carefully it will give you a lot of tips on multiple sources of Indian and on Persian bladed weapons.

Drabant1701 · 24th April 2022, 06:30 PM

Thanks Ariel! I have Jens book, I bought it when he published it. I will have to read it more carefully.

23rd April 2022, 04:45 PM	#1
Drabant1701 Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Sweden Posts: 181	"Thus, the secrets of wootz are still undiscovered, but who needs them? Modern metallurgy produces iron alloys of unquestionably superior quality." Back when I started collecting I bought only eropean and american arms, but after seeing wootz for the first time its been all oriental arms. I never ge3t tired of looking at a nice wootz blade And when I have your atention Ariel, I have this sword with an unmarked wootz blade, its my favorite wootz in my collection and its mounted on indian mounts but I do think the blade is persian. What do you think looking att the wootz in the picture below. Also here is a terrible movie of it https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/702399107 Attached Images Last edited by Drabant1701; 23rd April 2022 at 06:57 PM.

23rd April 2022, 10:15 PM	#2
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Very, very, very nice! To distinguish between Indian and Persian manufacture one needs a lot of luck ( Indian masters learned Persian technique sometimes in the 17th century and there were real Persian bladesmiths at the Mughal court and, likely, some private ones too), picture of the entire sword and another one focused at the part of the blade near the handle.

24th April 2022, 06:02 PM	#4
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	The blade is highly curved and tapering down to a very sharp tip. There is no “ indian ricasso”, ie an unsharpened part of the blade adjacent to the quillon block. Both of them together tell us this blade’s fashion ( and,-highly likely,- its origin): Persia. Suggest contacting Jens Nordlunde and check whether he still has a copy of his book “A passion for Indian arms”. If you read it carefully it will give you a lot of tips on multiple sources of Indian and on Persian bladed weapons.

24th April 2022, 06:30 PM	#5
Drabant1701 Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Sweden Posts: 181	Thanks Ariel! I have Jens book, I bought it when he published it. I will have to read it more carefully.