Sheath symbolism, does the concept of pamor extend also too wooden patterns?

[David]

Originally Posted by milandro

very beautiful and absolutely “ spooky” image on the Gambar (or Gandar as I’ve hears it called over here).

Reread what i wrote Milandro. The "gandar" of the sheath is the stem piece as i have correctly noted, where the Dwi Rho motif is situated. The "gambar" is the "boat" aspect of the wrongko. It was that part of the sheath that i called the "gambar" in my post.
When we see figures or faces in pamor patterns these are generally unplanned events and considered to be talismanic and powerful because they are "Acts of God". It is called pamor Raja Guntala. These pamors can have different significances dependent upon what they seem to depict. Never heard of them being used to predict the future though.

[David]

I will add that sometimes the choice of specific patterns in choice woods might be done simply for decorative purposes. Here is another example from my collection of wood grain that seems to be positioned to match the pamor pattern on the bottom of the gonjo. I don't believe this was done with any esoteric intention in mind, but rather to create a more complex ensemble feel.
It will be interesting to see what pamor pattern hides underneath the rust in your blade. If it turns out to be an adeg pamor there might be some connection to why the vertical lined wood was chosen for your gandar. Though more often than not i believe that people were more inclined not to want to reveal what pamor lies within their sheath, so maybe showing it publicly on the surface of the sheath would not be a popular idea.

[milandro]

Originally Posted by David

Reread what i wrote Milandro. The "gandar" of the sheath is the stem piece as i have correctly noted, where the Dwi Rho motif is situated. The "gambar" is the "boat" aspect of the wrongko. It was that part of the sheath that i called the "gambar" in my post.
When we see figures or faces in pamor patterns these are generally unplanned events and considered to be talismanic and powerful because they are "Acts of God". It is called pamor Raja Guntala. These pamors can have different significances dependent upon what they seem to depict. Never heard of them being used to predict the future though.

thank you for the correction, , I will add it to my lexicon. I though it was something like Warangka-Wrongko thing.

I did'n mean to say that there was any “ divination “ associated to the Indonesian symbolism but that in general in many cultures in the world, people look at “ shapes ” in things and attribute a meaning to that whether propitiatory, apotropaic or in some cases divinatory but I didn’t refer specifically to this happening in Indonesia.

[A. G. Maisey]

On the "warangka-wrongko" thing, this is the same word, just different ways of spelling it, I guess something similar to the way in which word spellings in English can can differ from place to place, and maybe for a similar reason, the variant spellings reflect the actual spoken sound.

The "a" sound in warangka/wrangka/rangka is pronounced very close to an "o", so the word becomes worongko/wrongko/rongko.

That "o" sound being substituted for an "a" is perhaps down to English language keyboards, in old days the sound was represented by an "a" with a dot over it, these days you can only tell the difference between a dotted "a" and an undotted "a" by learning the language.

But in Bahasa Indonesia, "warangka" will correctly be pronounced as it is written, the "a" is an "a".