British military practice sword

[fernando]

Jim, i am infinitely far from an authority in judging what your example would be, based on a Indian 1908 pattern grip and a 1911 Enfield blade but, my question is; could it be that the ‘hyper generous’ protective bowl it equips was of no established pattern but a whim of the owner or the unique style of some kind of association he was a member of … this given the colouring.
And if you allow me the irrelevance ...
Fencing techniques depending on their sense and purpose through time may have gone through an overlapping phenomenon. While fencing as a discipline for the training of combat have lasted for centuries (read millennia), another fencing attitude developing in the XVIII century made it become a 'sport'; was it Domenico Angelo, who established a fencing academy in Soho, London, for one ? So intentionaly selective that nowadays the interpreters of fencing, like those in an olyimpic sense, are called ‘players’, not ‘fighters’; they actually ‘play’ the fleuret (foil) in their escrime sessions. Naming the foil in French is also implicit, as the language used in this sport in many countries is obligatorily French; the referee uses therms like 'arrêt', 'pret' and 'allez'.


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[Jim McDougall]

I am inclined to agree Fernando, and while the use of the Indian style grip causes speculation toward the Raj, it could very well be one off with some private group as you suggest. These kinds of striping themes and brown and white for some reason recall military context, but perhaps that is from the striping on aircraft etc.

Well noted on the antiquity in fencing as necessary combat exercise with swords which indeed went into a sport oriented theme with Angelo, but I believe of course probably went further into Italian origins, as well as Spanish. Agrippa and other Spanish masters taught and wrote in the 16th c.

Many of the terms used in fencing are of course Italian, many from the Spanish treatises and their 'destreza', and as you note certain French terms.

The curiosity of my 'foil' lies in the composite nature as described, the use the the notably foil like 1911 blade and the 1908 grip. Like the M1908 British sword as well as the M1913 Patton, the thrust was the primary attack and this seems aligned to those large bowl guard swords. This was the basis for suggestions it may have military origin.

[fernando]

Jim, i did not want to stuff the thread with longer diverting but, once you mention it and, as per book cover illustrated in above third picture, we have a 1685 treatise where we see that the Destreza was practiced both in Spain and Portugal during the period, each with their own version.


.http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showpo...92&postcount=8

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by fernando

Jim, i did not want to stuff the thread with longer diverting but, once you mention it and, as per book cover illustrated in above third picture, we have a 1685 treatise where we see that the Destreza was practiced both in Spain and Portugal during the period, each with their own version.


.http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showpo...92&postcount=8

That is excellent! Your command of memory is great, and that discussion definitely adds to this overview.
I don't think that the bringing in of salient material detracts from discussions even if it is a bit 'off course' as it adds to the wider perspectives.
Thank you Fernando.