Shamshir - Naga?

[DavidFriedman]

Thanks Jim,
In fact this saber is extremely light in the hand and I feel dances, reminiscent of a snake. The wider bladed Kilij type silvery saber, also in the group picture, is much more too heavy and seems to be suited perhaps for cavalry slashes.

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

This is of course a Persian Qajar (revival piece as such arms & armor in this category are termed) version of early traditional swords. The term 'shamshir' is a Persian collective term for sabers which is typically associated with the curved blades with sharp point and most often of wootz.

Regarding the serpent, in Persian symbology, these typically represent 'Zahnak' which although an evil creature, but the salient factor here seems to be that it was said to be able to strike more quickly than the blink of an eye.
These serpents are seen in many Persian edged weapon blade motif, and there are some which have two heads.

Interestingly, these serpents are even seen on some 'kaskara' broadswords in Sudan, reflecting the profound influence of Persian weapons through of course religious beliefs there.

The note of 'nagan' (=snake) blades is indeed well known not only in India in Hindu and other religious symbolism, but characterized on many 'wavy' style blades such as in the keris and others.

[Jim McDougall]

[QUOTE=DavidFriedman;264049]Thanks Jim,
In fact this saber is extremely light in the hand and I feel dances, reminiscent of a snake. The wider bladed Kilij type silvery saber, also in the group picture, is much more too heavy and seems to be suited perhaps for cavalry slashes.[/QUOT

Just asides, the wavy bladed swords having to do with the naga (snake) in India and Asian, Indonesian cultures are seen as well in 'the west' in medieval sword blades often termed 'flamberge', taken to mean 'flaming sword'. This has to do with Biblical reference to the flaming sword which guarded the gates to the Garden of Eden.

In Viking and Germanic swords the pattern welding causing patterns in the steel of the blade were regarded as serpent like, and the brilliant paper "The Serpent in the Blade" by Dr. Lee Jones had to do with this perspective.

In many Mexican knife blades the phrase, 'when this snake bites, there is no cure' is often seen.

[DavidFriedman]

Thanks Jim. My friend has some exquisite Kris and Indonesian Archipelago weapons with wonderful serpentine designs. I have yet to collect any, but probably will in the future.


[QUOTE=Jim McDougall;264072]

Originally Posted by DavidFriedman

Thanks Jim,
In fact this saber is extremely light in the hand and I feel dances, reminiscent of a snake. The wider bladed Kilij type silvery saber, also in the group picture, is much more too heavy and seems to be suited perhaps for cavalry slashes.[/QUOT

Just asides, the wavy bladed swords having to do with the naga (snake) in India and Asian, Indonesian cultures are seen as well in 'the west' in medieval sword blades often termed 'flamberge', taken to mean 'flaming sword'. This has to do with Biblical reference to the flaming sword which guarded the gates to the Garden of Eden.

In Viking and Germanic swords the pattern welding causing patterns in the steel of the blade were regarded as serpent like, and the brilliant paper "The Serpent in the Blade" by Dr. Lee Jones had to do with this perspective.

In many Mexican knife blades the phrase, 'when this snake bites, there is no cure' is often seen.

[Jim McDougall]

[QUOTE=DavidFriedman;264077]Thanks Jim. My friend has some exquisite Kris and Indonesian Archipelago weapons with wonderful serpentine designs. I have yet to collect any, but probably will in the future.



You bet David, and thanks for the additional pics, very impressive! and nice example!!

[DavidFriedman]

Thanks, it’s such a joy to collect these pieces of history.

[QUOTE=Jim McDougall;264081]

Originally Posted by DavidFriedman

Thanks Jim. My friend has some exquisite Kris and Indonesian Archipelago weapons with wonderful serpentine designs. I have yet to collect any, but probably will in the future.





You bet David, and thanks for the additional pics, very impressive! and nice example!!

[Drabant1701]

Very nice collection david! Do you have it on the wall like that with all three swords and the shield? The shield btw is fantastic, just the right amount of wear and patina.

[DavidFriedman]

Thanks so much. I currently don’t have them on the wall like that, but on Chinese and Japanese sword stands. It would be nice to put them on the wall. That’s a good idea, if I can find a way to do it properly.

Yes the shield is a beauty. The Qajar work is very alluring to me. Such aesthetic.

Originally Posted by Drabant1701

Very nice collection david! Do you have it on the wall like that with all three swords and the shield? The shield btw is fantastic, just the right amount of wear and patina.

[Philip]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

In many Mexican knife blades the phrase, 'when this snake bites, there is no cure' is often seen.

They're probably more dangerous when they tempt you with apple clenched in fangs!

[DavidFriedman]

Ah, the illuminating apple that brings the knowledge of good and evil, muwahahaha

Originally Posted by Philip

They're probably more dangerous when they tempt you with apple clenched in fangs!