recent ? jade hilted indian dagger

francantolin · 5th February 2021, 02:36 PM

Hello dear members,
I wanted your opinion about this dagger,
I bought it in an auction house but without informations about age and a correct price...
I think there is a date and a signature on the other side of the blade but I can't recognize it.
arabic ? hindi ? fantasy ?...

Is it recent indian made ? Nice hilt but the eyes are basic who make me think of a recent stuff...
( so if we can find the date it's good...

)
Still a niece piece: It's pretty heavy and big: 43cm long

What do you think ?

Kind regards

colin henshaw · 5th February 2021, 02:41 PM

It looks like the blade from a Sudanese arm dagger on a modern Indian hilt

ALEX · 5th February 2021, 02:50 PM

Agree with Colin, modern Indian hilt, crude machine work, the material is Aventurine quartz, but they call every green stone a jade of course

mahratt · 5th February 2021, 04:17 PM

Alex and Colin are certainly right. The hilt of modern work.

francantolin · 5th February 2021, 06:07 PM

Thank you for your comments.

That's certainly why the starting price was hopefully low...
Yes the hilt shows aventurescence on some parts of the hilt,
crazy indeed, it was the principal lot in the double page catalogue describing 20-30 other lots,
with a large picture of the hilt and described as jade hilt and 19th century...

sure I didn't believe it was a mughal period hilt or made of thick jade jadeite hilt but at least something correct...

for the sudanese blade idea, it can be, I found looks like on oriental arms
( not the flat tourist blades, this one is half cm thick and well sharpened )

So it ''must'' be arabic, any idea about the date/signature ??

ALEX · 5th February 2021, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by francantolin

...it was the principal lot in the double page catalogue describing 20-30 other lots, with a large picture of the hilt and described as jade hilt and 19th century...

Deep ignorance, or perhaps intentional, on auction's part. any specialist will see the traces of electric drilling "dremel" machine on the surface, visible with naked eye, even on photos, so they do not even have the basic, not to mention any specialized knowledge

There is no signature on the blade, the date is not in Arabic, it looks like 1990 (?)

Kubur · 5th February 2021, 07:52 PM

yes it is 1990 and it is a recent Sudanese blade
sorry francatolin...

francantolin · 5th February 2021, 08:10 PM

1990...

Ok,
It's done !
I'll try to sell it...

Thank you for your time and comments

A.alnakkas · 14th February 2021, 08:23 PM

it may look like the date 1990 but its the word الخرطوم Khartoum upside down.

Kubur · 14th February 2021, 10:05 PM

Interesting, and logic,
what about the other side?
I can read 1421 hg, 2000 our calendar.

A.alnakkas · 14th February 2021, 10:14 PM

Other side says Om Durman ام درمان

Kubur · 14th February 2021, 10:47 PM

Mmmm are you sure it's what you read or what you wish to see?
Not convinced at all on this one...

A.alnakkas · 15th February 2021, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Mmmm are you sure it's what you read or what you wish to see?
Not convinced at all on this one...

Perhaps you should ask yourself this question, my friend.

francantolin · 16th February 2021, 07:14 PM

Hello,

Thank's a lot Abdullatif for your comments / translations !!

So better with the pictures positionned like that I think

.

Om Durman is too a city in Soudan ?
Or can it be something else ?

Kind regards

Frankie

Kubur · 16th February 2021, 08:52 PM

Omdurman was the capital of the Dervishes, in front of Khartum
It's a regular inscription that you can find on many Sudanese weapons, including tourist items.
I wish to believe my friend al nakkas, but I cannot see the letters...
Anyway this blade is recent.

francantolin · 16th February 2021, 09:51 PM

Yes it can be.
But what is sure , it's no 1990 anymore

5th February 2021, 02:36 PM	#1
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 902	recent ? jade hilted indian dagger Hello dear members, I wanted your opinion about this dagger, I bought it in an auction house but without informations about age and a correct price... I think there is a date and a signature on the other side of the blade but I can't recognize it. arabic ? hindi ? fantasy ?... Is it recent indian made ? Nice hilt but the eyes are basic who make me think of a recent stuff... ( so if we can find the date it's good... ) Still a niece piece: It's pretty heavy and big: 43cm long What do you think ? Kind regards Attached Images

16th February 2021, 07:14 PM	#14
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 902	Hello, Thank's a lot Abdullatif for your comments / translations !! So better with the pictures positionned like that I think . Om Durman is too a city in Soudan ? Or can it be something else ? Kind regards Frankie Attached Images

5th February 2021, 02:41 PM	#2
colin henshaw Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,429	It looks like the blade from a Sudanese arm dagger on a modern Indian hilt

5th February 2021, 02:50 PM	#3
ALEX Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 936	Agree with Colin, modern Indian hilt, crude machine work, the material is Aventurine quartz, but they call every green stone a jade of course

5th February 2021, 04:17 PM	#4
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	Alex and Colin are certainly right. The hilt of modern work.

5th February 2021, 06:07 PM	#5
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 902	Thank you for your comments. That's certainly why the starting price was hopefully low... Yes the hilt shows aventurescence on some parts of the hilt, crazy indeed, it was the principal lot in the double page catalogue describing 20-30 other lots, with a large picture of the hilt and described as jade hilt and 19th century... sure I didn't believe it was a mughal period hilt or made of thick jade jadeite hilt but at least something correct... for the sudanese blade idea, it can be, I found looks like on oriental arms ( not the flat tourist blades, this one is half cm thick and well sharpened ) So it ''must'' be arabic, any idea about the date/signature ??

5th February 2021, 07:52 PM	#7
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	yes it is 1990 and it is a recent Sudanese blade sorry francatolin...

5th February 2021, 08:10 PM	#8
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 902	1990... Ok, It's done ! I'll try to sell it... Thank you for your time and comments

14th February 2021, 08:23 PM	#9
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	it may look like the date 1990 but its the word الخرطوم Khartoum upside down.

14th February 2021, 10:05 PM	#10
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Interesting, and logic, what about the other side? I can read 1421 hg, 2000 our calendar.

14th February 2021, 10:14 PM	#11
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Other side says Om Durman ام درمان

14th February 2021, 10:47 PM	#12
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Mmmm are you sure it's what you read or what you wish to see? Not convinced at all on this one...

16th February 2021, 08:52 PM	#15
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Omdurman was the capital of the Dervishes, in front of Khartum It's a regular inscription that you can find on many Sudanese weapons, including tourist items. I wish to believe my friend al nakkas, but I cannot see the letters... Anyway this blade is recent.

16th February 2021, 09:51 PM	#16
francantolin Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 902	Yes it can be. But what is sure , it's no 1990 anymore