Nimcha for Comments and Musings on Nimchas

TVV · 16th January 2021, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Your new nimcha is amazing Teodor!

Thank you Kubur, I appreciate it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

On your new nimcha, is that patina or enamel in the hilt recesses?

Jose, it is not patina. It looks like remnants of paint or enamel.

Jim McDougall · 16th January 2021, 05:48 AM

This is an outstanding topic and thread Teodor, and absolutely wonderful grouping of these swords! Congratulations on the beautiful new example you have added and I very much agree with your comments.
While I of course have nothing but the highest regard for Mr. Buttin, like all of the long venerated arms writers, they were far from infallible. The 14th-15th c. suggestion for #991 is remarkably unlikely and exceeds optimism.

As far as I have understood this distinctive guard system evolved most likely in Italy in the late 15th century as Tony North described in his " A Late 15th Century Italian Sword" (Connoisseur, Dec. 1975, fig.3). The assimilation into the Ceylonese sphere with the similar system in the 'kastane' appears to have arisen sometime about a century later, but from again similar hilt designs in South India, Deccan of 15th c. ("Arts of the Muslim Knight", B. Mohamed, 2008, p.206, #197). It does seem the quillon system was circulating through trade networks in 15th into 16th c. but its character in my opinion reflects Italian sword design innovations as the rapier styles were evolving.

In Mohamed (op. cit. #40; #41 and #60) all show these 'peaked' type hilts of these sa'if commonly termed 'nimcha' .
#40 has the D-ring and is attributed to N. Africa 16th-17th c. The blade has a 'cog'wheel' mark known of German smiths of 16th c. and the hilt designs are Ottoman form of 16th c.

#60 is of the Deccan in India with the peak and same hilt styling but with characteristic Indian quillon terminals and langet, said to be 17th c. \

#41 is of Algeria, Oran c. 1700. The same type sword was captured at the Battle of Oran n 1732. One of these had the toughra of Mustafa II (1695-1703) on the blade.

The same hilt and quillon system seems too have prevailed mostly in the Maghreb from 17th c. into 18th, but as always, tradition keeps forms around much longer than collectively recognized. It seems that the 'peak' had basically diminished by the18th c.

It seems that Stone regarded these as Algerian, while collectors have always deemed the 'nimcha' as Moroccan.

It does seem that the instances of English merchants wearing nimcha in the early to mid years of 17th c. come from diplomatic trade relations with Morocco.
In the past there have been numbers of attempts to classify nimcha regionally by hilt features and quillon character, but I am not sure this can be reliably done.

The 'D ring' guard for example has long been regarded as a Zanzibar form, but here Buttin refers to them only as Arab, collectively grouped with the other forms of variation.

With the example posted here in the opening of the thread, that blade looks distinctly Italian, and those markings reflect characteristics of Italian lettered marks in parallel, and quite possibly 17th c. The unusual raised section on the blade back nearest hilt seems like Italian blades I have seen.

Attached is a Hafsid sovereign of Tunis wearing a nimcha c. 1573. While we cannot rely on accuracy necessarily, the peak seems absent but by the notations on the example from N. Africa (Mohamed, op. cit. #40) from Oran Algeria of late16th c. the design did exist there.

TVV · 16th January 2021, 06:50 AM

Jim, thank you for your thorough comments. I have the Furusiyya Foundation book and it is a great reference. It shows a nimcha with a hilt, covered by turtle shell and silver (#41), and then mentions the 4 similar swords captured in 1732 and now in the Real Armeria. This info is again repeated in the recent Met book to which Kwiatek contributed translations. However, I have reasons to believe these turtle shell hilts appeared a century or so earlier, because a fine example now in the Rijksmuseum was captured by Michiel de Ruyter in 1655:

https://www.rijksmuseum.nl/en/collection/NG-NM-10412

In the Malta Armory, among the many nimchas there is one with a D-ring, but it is there nonetheless. These swords were trophies of the knights of St. John, captured in naval battles in the Mediterranean, in a period from the 16th to the late 18th centuries (the order seized to exist after that courtesy of Napoleon). So there are most certainly Maghrebi nimchas with this feature. The lovely example in the Hofburg (also shown in Claude's great book) also has a D-ring and since it is probably connected to the Habsburgs, it likely came from the Mediterranean too (and it is decorated in an Ottoman style).

When it comes to guard and quillon style, I wonder if the approach of trying to differentiate on a purely regional basis is flawed as some variations may be chronological in character.

Regards,
Teodor

David R · 21st January 2021, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TVV

In the Malta Armory, among the many nimchas there is one with a D-ring, but it is there nonetheless. These swords were trophies of the knights of St. John, captured in naval battles in the Mediterranean, in a period from the 16th to the late 18th centuries (the order seized to exist after that courtesy of Napoleon). So there are most certainly Maghrebi nimchas with this feature. The lovely example in the Hofburg (also shown in Claude's great book) also has a D-ring and since it is probably connected to the Habsburgs, it likely came from the Mediterranean too (and it is decorated in an Ottoman style).

When it comes to guard and quillon style, I wonder if the approach of trying to differentiate on a purely regional basis is flawed as some variations may be chronological in character.

Regards,
Teodor

A big thank you for posting those in the top photo. All too often we see only the "pretty" examples, rather than the workaday ones carried by the majority.

TVV · 22nd January 2021, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David R

A big thank you for posting those in the top photo. All too often we see only the "pretty" examples, rather than the workaday ones carried by the majority.

David, in the link below you can see all of the nimchas and other Ottoman arms in the Knights' Armory in Valletta, most of them are fighting examples without the elaborate decoration reserved for those of higher status and wealth:

http://vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=24898

eftihis · 28th January 2021, 12:21 PM

I believe this sword was from the time of the siege of Malta.
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1530

David R · 28th January 2021, 01:02 PM

Thank you for the link, some very interesting blades there, including what looks like a (pseudo) Shashka.
Which reminded me that during the 17th C English Civil War a captured crew of Barbary Pirates in Exeter Jail were made an offer they couldn't refuse... Fight for Parliament or be executed.
After the war those surviving were released to go home, and home was a lot of different places in the Muslim World. We know this because they were given the usual documents for released soldiery of the time which stated their home town/origin as by law they had to go by the most direct route.

TVV · 29th January 2021, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eftihis

I believe this sword was from the time of the siege of Malta.
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1530

The Great Siege of Malta was all the way back in 1565. As far as I am aware, there are no trophies collected from the Ottomans during those events that have indisputable provenance. Only one of the swords in the Armory in Valletta is attributed to Turgut Reis, but considering that he was killed by stone debris from a cannon ball that hit near him deep into the Ottoman positions, it is unlikely that the Knights would have gotten the opportunity to retrieve anything from his body (Spiteri, the author of the only modern published catalogue of the collection expresses his doubts as well). It is very hard to link any sword directly to the Siege of Malta or even to that period.

That being said, you have a fantastic sword Eftihis. It is clearly old and unique due to the baskethilt.

16th January 2021, 05:48 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,454	This is an outstanding topic and thread Teodor, and absolutely wonderful grouping of these swords! Congratulations on the beautiful new example you have added and I very much agree with your comments. While I of course have nothing but the highest regard for Mr. Buttin, like all of the long venerated arms writers, they were far from infallible. The 14th-15th c. suggestion for #991 is remarkably unlikely and exceeds optimism. As far as I have understood this distinctive guard system evolved most likely in Italy in the late 15th century as Tony North described in his " A Late 15th Century Italian Sword" (Connoisseur, Dec. 1975, fig.3). The assimilation into the Ceylonese sphere with the similar system in the 'kastane' appears to have arisen sometime about a century later, but from again similar hilt designs in South India, Deccan of 15th c. ("Arts of the Muslim Knight", B. Mohamed, 2008, p.206, #197). It does seem the quillon system was circulating through trade networks in 15th into 16th c. but its character in my opinion reflects Italian sword design innovations as the rapier styles were evolving. In Mohamed (op. cit. #40; #41 and #60) all show these 'peaked' type hilts of these sa'if commonly termed 'nimcha' . #40 has the D-ring and is attributed to N. Africa 16th-17th c. The blade has a 'cog'wheel' mark known of German smiths of 16th c. and the hilt designs are Ottoman form of 16th c. #60 is of the Deccan in India with the peak and same hilt styling but with characteristic Indian quillon terminals and langet, said to be 17th c. \ #41 is of Algeria, Oran c. 1700. The same type sword was captured at the Battle of Oran n 1732. One of these had the toughra of Mustafa II (1695-1703) on the blade. The same hilt and quillon system seems too have prevailed mostly in the Maghreb from 17th c. into 18th, but as always, tradition keeps forms around much longer than collectively recognized. It seems that the 'peak' had basically diminished by the18th c. It seems that Stone regarded these as Algerian, while collectors have always deemed the 'nimcha' as Moroccan. It does seem that the instances of English merchants wearing nimcha in the early to mid years of 17th c. come from diplomatic trade relations with Morocco. In the past there have been numbers of attempts to classify nimcha regionally by hilt features and quillon character, but I am not sure this can be reliably done. The 'D ring' guard for example has long been regarded as a Zanzibar form, but here Buttin refers to them only as Arab, collectively grouped with the other forms of variation. With the example posted here in the opening of the thread, that blade looks distinctly Italian, and those markings reflect characteristics of Italian lettered marks in parallel, and quite possibly 17th c. The unusual raised section on the blade back nearest hilt seems like Italian blades I have seen. Attached is a Hafsid sovereign of Tunis wearing a nimcha c. 1573. While we cannot rely on accuracy necessarily, the peak seems absent but by the notations on the example from N. Africa (Mohamed, op. cit. #40) from Oran Algeria of late16th c. the design did exist there. Attached Images

16th January 2021, 06:50 AM	#3
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,666	Jim, thank you for your thorough comments. I have the Furusiyya Foundation book and it is a great reference. It shows a nimcha with a hilt, covered by turtle shell and silver (#41), and then mentions the 4 similar swords captured in 1732 and now in the Real Armeria. This info is again repeated in the recent Met book to which Kwiatek contributed translations. However, I have reasons to believe these turtle shell hilts appeared a century or so earlier, because a fine example now in the Rijksmuseum was captured by Michiel de Ruyter in 1655: https://www.rijksmuseum.nl/en/collection/NG-NM-10412 In the Malta Armory, among the many nimchas there is one with a D-ring, but it is there nonetheless. These swords were trophies of the knights of St. John, captured in naval battles in the Mediterranean, in a period from the 16th to the late 18th centuries (the order seized to exist after that courtesy of Napoleon). So there are most certainly Maghrebi nimchas with this feature. The lovely example in the Hofburg (also shown in Claude's great book) also has a D-ring and since it is probably connected to the Habsburgs, it likely came from the Mediterranean too (and it is decorated in an Ottoman style). When it comes to guard and quillon style, I wonder if the approach of trying to differentiate on a purely regional basis is flawed as some variations may be chronological in character. Regards, Teodor Attached Images

28th January 2021, 12:21 PM	#6
eftihis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Chania Crete Greece Posts: 512	I believe this sword was from the time of the siege of Malta. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1530 Attached Images

28th January 2021, 01:02 PM	#7
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,123	Thank you for the link, some very interesting blades there, including what looks like a (pseudo) Shashka. Which reminded me that during the 17th C English Civil War a captured crew of Barbary Pirates in Exeter Jail were made an offer they couldn't refuse... Fight for Parliament or be executed. After the war those surviving were released to go home, and home was a lot of different places in the Muslim World. We know this because they were given the usual documents for released soldiery of the time which stated their home town/origin as by law they had to go by the most direct route.