African Sabre, West Africa....Ivory Coast???

Tim Simmons · 10th May 2006, 07:58 PM

Canvas and other cloth is a very common material used to form the core of scabbards and handles across much of the southern Sahel. Presumably this is because of the high density of population in relation to the scarcity and how slowly wood grows in the area, or how easily it is consumed by insects, or perhaps it is just cheap and easily rolled and formed into various shapes. The tabouka like sabre I post pictures of some days back had a canvass core to the scabbard and handle.

katana · 10th May 2006, 08:19 PM

Thanks, again, Tim ,
I had originally thought the canvas was significant, however that seems to be incorrect.....never mind

.
If you've time would you mind looking at my other thread about a Shona axe, your input/ comments are always appreciated.

Jim McDougall · 11th May 2006, 01:48 AM

Hi Katana,
You are really busy! and acquiring some most interesting examples!

As Tim has very astutely observed, this very heavy blade does appear to be a naval cutlass blade. It would seem this blade most likely from a French naval cutlass, probably the M1792, though the blade is interestingly a bit more parabolically curved. It would not be surprising for suppliers to the French after the Egyptian campaigns to have been inclined to such feature.
See "Boarders Away" , William Gilkerson , R.I.1991 (p.78, fig's #20,21) for examples of this pattern, typically mounted with three branch guard.

Obviously, during the 19th century, the coasts of West Africa were heavily colonized by the French, and these naval blades found thier way into native armouries. The blades were of course remounted many times, well into the 19th century. The history of these regions, the tormenting and unfortunate tragedies of the slaving, and the rich culture later imbued into the Americas does indeed include romantic tales.......and it seems quite likely this blade in its more recent mounts most probably has some of its own!!!
Now, what was that about sanity?

All the best, from another romantic,
Jim

katana · 11th May 2006, 10:19 AM

Thanks Jim, after both yours and Tim's comments I am increasingly becoming impatient ....... I'm still waiting for the sword's arrival.
To me, it’s the individual history of a weapon that 'breathes life' into such inanimate objects.
Hopefully, I may find a makers mark or serial no. which may date the blade......

fearn · 11th May 2006, 04:00 PM

I wouldn't be surprised if the blade is from the 1800s, although it's in very good shape for a blade from the 18th century (1700s).

That said, I think that the fittings are in *amazingly* good shape for a 200-300 year old sword, especially one that has such common fittings, and that was supposedly in West Africa. Am I the only one who thinks it might have been remounted a few times?

F

katana · 18th June 2006, 12:07 AM

Sorry wrong thread... too many pages open at once

10th May 2006, 07:58 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,922	Canvas and other cloth is a very common material used to form the core of scabbards and handles across much of the southern Sahel. Presumably this is because of the high density of population in relation to the scarcity and how slowly wood grows in the area, or how easily it is consumed by insects, or perhaps it is just cheap and easily rolled and formed into various shapes. The tabouka like sabre I post pictures of some days back had a canvass core to the scabbard and handle.

10th May 2006, 08:19 PM	#2
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Thanks, again, Tim , I had originally thought the canvas was significant, however that seems to be incorrect.....never mind . If you've time would you mind looking at my other thread about a Shona axe, your input/ comments are always appreciated.

11th May 2006, 01:48 AM	#3
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,660	Hi Katana, You are really busy! and acquiring some most interesting examples! As Tim has very astutely observed, this very heavy blade does appear to be a naval cutlass blade. It would seem this blade most likely from a French naval cutlass, probably the M1792, though the blade is interestingly a bit more parabolically curved. It would not be surprising for suppliers to the French after the Egyptian campaigns to have been inclined to such feature. See "Boarders Away" , William Gilkerson , R.I.1991 (p.78, fig's #20,21) for examples of this pattern, typically mounted with three branch guard. Obviously, during the 19th century, the coasts of West Africa were heavily colonized by the French, and these naval blades found thier way into native armouries. The blades were of course remounted many times, well into the 19th century. The history of these regions, the tormenting and unfortunate tragedies of the slaving, and the rich culture later imbued into the Americas does indeed include romantic tales.......and it seems quite likely this blade in its more recent mounts most probably has some of its own!!! Now, what was that about sanity? All the best, from another romantic, Jim

11th May 2006, 10:19 AM	#4
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Thanks Jim, after both yours and Tim's comments I am increasingly becoming impatient ....... I'm still waiting for the sword's arrival. To me, it’s the individual history of a weapon that 'breathes life' into such inanimate objects. Hopefully, I may find a makers mark or serial no. which may date the blade......

11th May 2006, 04:00 PM	#5
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	I wouldn't be surprised if the blade is from the 1800s, although it's in very good shape for a blade from the 18th century (1700s). That said, I think that the fittings are in amazingly good shape for a 200-300 year old sword, especially one that has such common fittings, and that was supposedly in West Africa. Am I the only one who thinks it might have been remounted a few times? F

18th June 2006, 12:07 AM	#6
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Sorry wrong thread... too many pages open at once