Opinions on Javanese Keris

A. G. Maisey · 31st January 2020, 06:25 AM

I've seen both these symbols,

The round one is, as David has said,widely recognised as a sun symbol, in Jawa it can refer to the Sun, or it can refer to Surya, the Sun Deity. If it is recognised as the weapon of Wisnu, it is his discus, and by extension refers to Wisnu himself. In Jawa this motif is called the Cakra.

The other symbol is uncommon, I have seen it illustrated, I have never seen it actually applied to anything. I do have at least one picture of it in one of my books, I've had a quick look and cannot find it. It is a legitimate symbol, not a one off, so somebody with the time and the inclination will find it sooner or later.

The white metal scabbard fittings are made from mamas, if they do not test as silver.

My impression is that this is a relatively recent creation. The blade gives me the feeling that it is a robahan (a changeling), but not yesterday, maybe late Colonial era, however, the kinatah work I am virtually certain is very recent.

Jean · 31st January 2020, 08:57 AM

The other rajah motif on the sorsoran is called "pilulut" and is deemed to help the kris owner to charm the opposite sex, see another specimen, and also a similar type of scabbard.
Regards

A. G. Maisey · 31st January 2020, 10:57 AM

That's good Jean.

I knew it was around somewhere, where did you get the info, or were you told and made a note of it?

Jean · 31st January 2020, 05:31 PM

Hello Alan,
I got it from the book Keris Jawa on page 250 for instance, but the reference about the magic properties is from another source which I cannot remember at present.
Regards

RSWORD · 31st January 2020, 06:17 PM

Thank you Alan and Jean for the additional information. Much appreciated.

A. G. Maisey · 31st January 2020, 06:45 PM

R Sword --- you're welcome

"Keris Jawa"? I did not even consider that as a possibility for an answer, just shows how easy it is for prejudice to make one wrong. I looked in a whole heap of little primers from before WWII, and a few of the more recent small booklets and came up empty.

The talismanic qualities I obviously had no idea about, but I have been advised by a reliable Javanese source that the pi - lulut should be read in conjunction with the cakra, and in this sense it can perhaps better be understood as devotion to Wisnu, or indication of the owner being a devotee of Wisnu (Vishnu), and thus relying upon him for protection.

The root, "lulut", can be understood as absolute devotion, or tameness, as well as romantic love.

JustYS · 1st February 2020, 04:38 AM

I’m a little bit confused, which symbol is representing “pilulut”?

RSWORD’s keris showed 2 types of symbol : Circle and Oval.

Jean’s keris showed the same Oval symbol.

Keris Jawa showed Oval symbol but not the same as Oval symbol as RSWORD and Jean’s Oval symbol.

Keris Jawa’s Oval symbol is similar as RSWORD’s Circle symbol.

Cheers,

31st January 2020, 08:57 AM	#2
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	The other rajah motif on the sorsoran is called "pilulut" and is deemed to help the kris owner to charm the opposite sex, see another specimen, and also a similar type of scabbard. Regards Attached Images

31st January 2020, 05:31 PM	#4
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Hello Alan, I got it from the book Keris Jawa on page 250 for instance, but the reference about the magic properties is from another source which I cannot remember at present. Regards Attached Images

31st January 2020, 06:25 AM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,048	I've seen both these symbols, The round one is, as David has said,widely recognised as a sun symbol, in Jawa it can refer to the Sun, or it can refer to Surya, the Sun Deity. If it is recognised as the weapon of Wisnu, it is his discus, and by extension refers to Wisnu himself. In Jawa this motif is called the Cakra. The other symbol is uncommon, I have seen it illustrated, I have never seen it actually applied to anything. I do have at least one picture of it in one of my books, I've had a quick look and cannot find it. It is a legitimate symbol, not a one off, so somebody with the time and the inclination will find it sooner or later. The white metal scabbard fittings are made from mamas, if they do not test as silver. My impression is that this is a relatively recent creation. The blade gives me the feeling that it is a robahan (a changeling), but not yesterday, maybe late Colonial era, however, the kinatah work I am virtually certain is very recent.

31st January 2020, 10:57 AM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,048	That's good Jean. I knew it was around somewhere, where did you get the info, or were you told and made a note of it?

31st January 2020, 06:17 PM	#5
RSWORD Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 1,087	Thank you Alan and Jean for the additional information. Much appreciated.

31st January 2020, 06:45 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,048	R Sword --- you're welcome "Keris Jawa"? I did not even consider that as a possibility for an answer, just shows how easy it is for prejudice to make one wrong. I looked in a whole heap of little primers from before WWII, and a few of the more recent small booklets and came up empty. The talismanic qualities I obviously had no idea about, but I have been advised by a reliable Javanese source that the pi - lulut should be read in conjunction with the cakra, and in this sense it can perhaps better be understood as devotion to Wisnu, or indication of the owner being a devotee of Wisnu (Vishnu), and thus relying upon him for protection. The root, "lulut", can be understood as absolute devotion, or tameness, as well as romantic love.

1st February 2020, 04:38 AM	#7
JustYS Member Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 146	I’m a little bit confused, which symbol is representing “pilulut”? RSWORD’s keris showed 2 types of symbol : Circle and Oval. Jean’s keris showed the same Oval symbol. Keris Jawa showed Oval symbol but not the same as Oval symbol as RSWORD and Jean’s Oval symbol. Keris Jawa’s Oval symbol is similar as RSWORD’s Circle symbol. Cheers,