Talismanic Devices and Imbuements on Islamic Arms

[Victrix]

We discussed four dots marks on swords in an earlier thread. See http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=dots . The question whether they could be forge or foundry identification marks, or have religious or superstitious/talismanic functions. If I understand this thread correctly, the three dots seems to be a fairly universal talismanic symbol offering ”protection” and the four dots could be a stronger 360˚ version offering ”protection” viewed from all directions.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Great point !! Yes agreed and above you see the three khanjar blades with the centre blade protected in all directions and both sides of the blade left and right as well as on the reverse; thus stopping evil from entering blade or hilt...In fact hilts sometimes carry the dots separately as well.. extra empowerment seems to be attached when the dots are in gold or brass/copper material..and it seems Islamic script itself a Talisman sometimes gets the three or four dot treatment. (the 5 dot is in fact unrelated as it stands alone as another Talisman altogether and representative of the five fingers or hand of Fatima often linked to the evil eye protective motif..In fact the saying goes "Heres five in your eye" when that Talisman is illustrated) as below.

As seen on this thread other objects get a similar treatment and I wondered if the transition to moons came as a result of this Talisman although so far as I can deduce moons as such were reserved for blades?

[Kubur]

Gentlemens at this stage of the discussion
I would like to share with you one of the most important fact:
a line is made of two points.

[Victrix]

Originally Posted by Kubur

Gentlemens at this stage of the discussion
I would like to share with you one of the most important fact:
a line is made of two points.

Are you saying we are getting a bit ”dotty” here??

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

I hesitate to add that we are also going around in circles !!

The question of dots is hardly touched here but the general Talisman focuss I think is well being advanced>> The mathematical wizardry involved in astrology we have hardly noted yet it is vast and pulls in all the mysterious Talisman and magical wonders described by my illustration of the Swordsman built from a star chart in Persia in the early11thC.

Shown below;from the Suwar al-kawakib al-thabita of al-Sufi dated1009-10

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

For a final thrust from the side of proof and discussion looking from the Ottoman advantage I offer the book of Iznic Patterns from more than 10 of the worlds finest museums and 650 plus diagrams and pictures where the chinthimani/ cintimanii gets two full pages dedicated to patterns of Iznic ceramics. The period is known as RHODEAN and covers the early 17th C in artisan production there.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Here is the book I spoke about above > and the early 17thC Rhodian period patterns; Chintamani

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Victrix

Are you saying we are getting a bit ”dotty” here??

Good quip Victrix!

Indeed 'connecting the dots' can be a bit maddening as we try to make sense out of these conundrums, and as Ibrahiim has noted.....we can often seem to be going in circles ......but these discussions can systematically map out the situations and circustances for better investigation.

The knowledge base and diversity of the membership here is phenomenal, and there is no better place to bring these things into the light.


We all share in the adventure.......and 'the games afoot!!'.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Thank you Jim for balancing the thread so far. I was reading about Tipu Sultan (The Tiger of Mysore) and noted Talisman devices on the famous cannon also decorated in Tigers …from http://www.mia.org.qa/en/tigers-dream/tipu-cannon

Quote"
The triumphant lion of God.

Like many other objects in this exhibition, this cannon is laden with tigers and inscriptions. The tiger motif is most forcefully expressed by the snarling tiger heads at the muzzle (front), trunnions (on the sides) and cascabel (back) of the gun barrel. Within a pair of tiger stripes on the barrel, an inscription calls on the ‘triumphant lion of God’, a phrase found regularly in calligraphic designs of this period. This inscription also provides the place and date of manufacture, while the presence of the heart-shaped ‘Haydar’ talisman shows that the cannon was cast at the sultan’s foundry".Unquote.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Broadening the search I have to include Alem >>>THe Islamic battle standard that also spread onto some blades SEE https://no.pinterest.com/pin/2568459...64161/?lp=true

And for a bladed example On a Safavid sword below;