Talismanic Devices and Imbuements on Islamic Arms

Jim McDougall · 31st January 2019, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

HELLO JIM... What a great thread!!

I heard that the arc sign called variously hogs back or eye lash marks was a secret sign made by prisoners to signal to a visitor or onlooker that all was OK … Would that indicate that the dots were actually toes..? And taken from ancient tradition as three is an auspicious number in many structures.

Thank you! It is good to see some traction in looking into these markings, which as noted regarding the typical lack of attention to explaining or any particular attention other than mentioning their presence.

These and many of the markings which were discussed over years in the trademarks thread have had many suggestions and explanations discussed, and most are of course apocryphal but indeed feasible in numerous cases.

What has brought us to these curious paired arcs (usually dentated) were the triple dots at the end of each arc. It seems certain such symbols may have been placed congruently with others to disguise them in degree.

As mentioned, in the case of 'dots' in Islamic parlance, in many cases the number and configuration may have simply been for 'luck', but with regard to the 'three' that may well have been with religious significance. It is always hard to guage just how much influence diffused into various cultures and regions from another, but the varied examples and cases can be estimated on their own merits.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 31st January 2019, 08:54 PM

I note that across the entire spectrum there appear certain key royal marks such as the Ottoman (Othmanli) Tughra although in this case below I show an Indian blade mark of Royal intent... The Parasol Mark. This mark thus appears as an imbuement to the other Talisman figures on these important weapons.

In addition it carries three dots atop the Parasol and second cartouche which is in Islamic script and flanked to one side by the Buduh square as well as ribbons of attribution to Religious Iconic figures; again in scripted gold style.

SEE https://auctionsimperial.hibid.com/l...=2&ref=catalog FOR THE SUPERB DESCRIPTION

Jens Nordlunde · 31st January 2019, 09:40 PM

Ibrahiim, could you possible turn the pictures so they will fit within the frame?
Thank you
Jens

Kubur · 31st January 2019, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

SEE https://auctionsimperial.hibid.com/l...=2&ref=catalog FOR THE SUPERB DESCRIPTION

... famous Imperial Parasol mark indicating it was owned by the Mughal Emperor...

Well in fact it was given by the Mughal emperor not owned... that's a huge difference... but still a royal provenance i agree

Jim McDougall · 1st February 2019, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

... famous Imperial Parasol mark indicating it was owned by the Mughal Emperor...

Well in fact it was given by the Mughal emperor not owned... that's a huge difference... but still a royal provenance i agree

Well noted, and I think what is being observed are the various perceptions toward these distinct occurrences of the gold parasol on certain very high quality Indian blades.

There are suggestions that the parasol mark was indicative of the finest Persian blade makers for Royal patrons, and that this mark indicates Royal ownership or indeed for presentation deserving such recognition.
The blade in the link also carries the Assad Allah cartouche, which of course aligns with the suggestion regarding Persian blade makers. Along with that is the beduh square, which brings the character of this blade into the talismanic perspective which is themed in Ibrahiims observation.

The parasol as being discussed, can also have talismanic properties being symbolized (still in its Royal connotation) in that it is of course a protective device in character, in addition to its auspicious meaning representing in effect the 'dome of heaven'.

In many examples of the parasol marking the three dot device is included at the base of the handle, also the dangling fringe dots from the parasol dome are typically three on each side.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 2nd February 2019, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Well noted, and I think what is being observed are the various perceptions toward these distinct occurrences of the gold parasol on certain very high quality Indian blades.

There are suggestions that the parasol mark was indicative of the finest Persian blade makers for Royal patrons, and that this mark indicates Royal ownership or indeed for presentation deserving such recognition.
The blade in the link also carries the Assad Allah cartouche, which of course aligns with the suggestion regarding Persian blade makers. Along with that is the beduh square, which brings the character of this blade into the talismanic perspective which is themed in Ibrahiims observation.

The parasol as being discussed, can also have talismanic properties being symbolized (still in its Royal connotation) in that it is of course a protective device in character, in addition to its auspicious meaning representing in effect the 'dome of heaven'.

In many examples of the parasol marking the three dot device is included at the base of the handle, also the dangling fringe dots from the parasol dome are typically three on each side.

HELLO Jim ..I note the following thread here on EAA Library as full of detail on the PARASOL on MUGHAL weapons. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=7165

In addition I add this dagger with Cartouche and Parasol as also of Royal linkage although in many cases not necessarily owned by the Emperor(BUT THIS ONE WAS SHAH JAHANs) but perhaps more his insignia denoting fine quality; probably made in a Royal Workshop. (The larger picture from the thread at para 1 at # 7 by RAND.)

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 2nd February 2019, 05:17 PM

Is it possible that the three dot form is in fact linked closely to Koranic script? ...see the picture of the very important red amulet below surrounded by the row of triple dots..With an important verse from the Koran inside the protective? dots.

This object is illustrated from the MET museum and incorporated at https://simergphotos.com/2013/02/19/...-muslim-world/

Jim McDougall · 2nd February 2019, 06:33 PM

That is truly an interesting and compelling note !
The 'three' is a significant numeral in many contexts it seems, and as it transcends cultures and religions, superstitions, etc. it is perceived accordingly.

While obviously the three in Christianity signifies the Holy Trinity, but in other religions it has similar purpose but clearly different in definition.

It would be interesting to see more on this angle of the three dots in use!

31st January 2019, 08:54 PM	#2
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	I note that across the entire spectrum there appear certain key royal marks such as the Ottoman (Othmanli) Tughra although in this case below I show an Indian blade mark of Royal intent... The Parasol Mark. This mark thus appears as an imbuement to the other Talisman figures on these important weapons. In addition it carries three dots atop the Parasol and second cartouche which is in Islamic script and flanked to one side by the Buduh square as well as ribbons of attribution to Religious Iconic figures; again in scripted gold style. SEE https://auctionsimperial.hibid.com/l...=2&ref=catalog FOR THE SUPERB DESCRIPTION Attached Images Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 31st January 2019 at 09:14 PM.

2nd February 2019, 05:17 PM	#7
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Is it possible that the three dot form is in fact linked closely to Koranic script? ...see the picture of the very important red amulet below surrounded by the row of triple dots..With an important verse from the Koran inside the protective? dots. This object is illustrated from the MET museum and incorporated at https://simergphotos.com/2013/02/19/...-muslim-world/ Attached Images Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 2nd February 2019 at 05:32 PM.

31st January 2019, 09:40 PM	#3
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Ibrahiim, could you possible turn the pictures so they will fit within the frame? Thank you Jens

2nd February 2019, 06:33 PM	#8
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,459	That is truly an interesting and compelling note ! The 'three' is a significant numeral in many contexts it seems, and as it transcends cultures and religions, superstitions, etc. it is perceived accordingly. While obviously the three in Christianity signifies the Holy Trinity, but in other religions it has similar purpose but clearly different in definition. It would be interesting to see more on this angle of the three dots in use!