Talismanic Devices and Imbuements on Islamic Arms

[Norman McCormick]

Hi,
Here's another configuration of the three dots. They are on a sword that I can only describe as an Indian style cutlass.
Regards,
Norman.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Norman McCormick

Hi,
Here's another configuration of the three dots. They are on a sword that I can only describe as an Indian style cutlass.
Regards,
Norman.

Most tactfully and well described Norman lest we stir another 'name game' debate!! It seems that the term may be well placed, given that the Marathas were known for their notable naval power.


Ibrahiim thank you for these further examples into use on guns in various contexts. It seems I recall in our findings that in many cases there were numbers of gold metal filled dots on the blades of early Islamic swords (varied in number) which were said to be talismans to bring luck.


With reference to the three dot configuration in European context, the heavy bladed swords with rebated blade tips typically used as 'bearing swords' (though often termed more nefariously) often had three holes at the tip of the blade. These have been explained as to be there to create a whistling in the stroke; to attach weights and not sure of what other fanciful purposes..however the representation of the Holy Trinity is most reasonable.


Curiously, heavy bladed swords in Africa claimed to be used in similar purpose in cases have had the same three holes in the same blade location.


Jens shows a great example of Mughal tulwar with the familiar sickle and three dots configuration, clearly copying the European mark well known on blades elsewhere in India in many instances.

[fernando]

If we look at "Armi Bianche Italiane" (Boccia/Coelho), we can see the dots "all over" such work. Curiously the authors care to add in index of all weapons illustrated in the book but i don't see any their assessment on the dots interpretation.


.

[Jim McDougall]

Excellent example Fernando, and Boccia & Coelho (1975) is an outstanding reference with comprehensive illustrations of these many known markings. As noted, there really are no details or insights into the symbolism imbued in any of them (or few) and these are realized as occurring on blades with period or regional attribution noted but not necessarily particular maker.

This suggests of course that these markings, in which configurations are often multiply used or in varying numbers ,are most likely renderings of certain devices or imbuements. We know that the 'Genoan' sickle (dentated arcs) marks were apparently some type of mark used in Genoa, or attributed to that city as a departure port for blades. The mark actually occurs on blades from other centers as well.

This I think was the reason the mark became so widely copied, as it noted 'quality' in these blades so widely traded, and just as with Toledo as well as Solingen/Passau that connotation prevailed.

[Jens Nordlunde]

Thank you for showing this Fernando, some of them I have never seen before.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Excellent example Fernando, and Boccia & Coelho (1975) is an outstanding reference with comprehensive illustrations of these many known markings. As noted, there really are no details or insights into the symbolism imbued in any of them (or few) and these are realized as occurring on blades with period or regional attribution noted but not necessarily particular maker.

This suggests of course that these markings, in which configurations are often multiply used or in varying numbers ,are most likely renderings of certain devices or imbuements. We know that the 'Genoan' sickle (dentated arcs) marks were apparently some type of mark used in Genoa, or attributed to that city as a departure port for blades. The mark actually occurs on blades from other centers as well.

This I think was the reason the mark became so widely copied, as it noted 'quality' in these blades so widely traded, and just as with Toledo as well as Solingen/Passau that connotation prevailed.

HELLO JIM... What a great thread!!

I heard that the arc sign called variously hogs back or eye lash marks was a secret sign made by prisoners to signal to a visitor or onlooker that all was OK … Would that indicate that the dots were actually toes..? And taken from ancient tradition as three is an auspicious number in many structures.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

HELLO JIM... What a great thread!!

I heard that the arc sign called variously hogs back or eye lash marks was a secret sign made by prisoners to signal to a visitor or onlooker that all was OK … Would that indicate that the dots were actually toes..? And taken from ancient tradition as three is an auspicious number in many structures.

Thank you! It is good to see some traction in looking into these markings, which as noted regarding the typical lack of attention to explaining or any particular attention other than mentioning their presence.

These and many of the markings which were discussed over years in the trademarks thread have had many suggestions and explanations discussed, and most are of course apocryphal but indeed feasible in numerous cases.

What has brought us to these curious paired arcs (usually dentated) were the triple dots at the end of each arc. It seems certain such symbols may have been placed congruently with others to disguise them in degree.

As mentioned, in the case of 'dots' in Islamic parlance, in many cases the number and configuration may have simply been for 'luck', but with regard to the 'three' that may well have been with religious significance. It is always hard to guage just how much influence diffused into various cultures and regions from another, but the varied examples and cases can be estimated on their own merits.

[Ibrahiim al Balooshi]

I note that across the entire spectrum there appear certain key royal marks such as the Ottoman (Othmanli) Tughra although in this case below I show an Indian blade mark of Royal intent... The Parasol Mark. This mark thus appears as an imbuement to the other Talisman figures on these important weapons.

In addition it carries three dots atop the Parasol and second cartouche which is in Islamic script and flanked to one side by the Buduh square as well as ribbons of attribution to Religious Iconic figures; again in scripted gold style.

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