Cirebon hilt?

[David]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

In Javanese/Balinese art motifs, a figure with fangs is identifiable as demon.

Raksasa is a male ogre, raksasi is a female ogre, an ogre is actually a monster that eats human flesh.

Thus when we call these types of hilts "raksasa" we're being pretty general, its pretty loose terminology.Maybe a bit more "Collectorese".

If we look at origins and turn to Hindu beliefs, what we find is that rakshasas & rakshasis are shape shifters, and not all of them are necessarily bad guys.

If we were going to get really pedantic we probably should only use the term "raksasa" for demons that haunt cemeteries and eat human flesh.

Anyway, Athanase's hilt has got fangs, thus it is a demon. Raksasa is probably OK. If we don't call him a raksasa, what do we call him?

Squatting ancestor with fangs Jean? Interesting idea.

Ancestors eventually become one with their deities, and often are depicted in pit burial mode. But with fangs?

So why are these demons used as hilt figures? Are they all demons? Maybe they're guardians? Or maybe they really are demons and their purpose is keep the really bad guys away from the sacred Meru.Lots of room there for discussion.

I think we've visited this previously.

Well Alan, you bring up exactly why i asked the question of Jean to begin with. When figures begin to attract i suppose there is always room for interpretation. Fangs? I'm not convinced i am seeing fangs on Athanase's figure. Yes there are what appear to be a couple of curved shapes near the corners of the mouth, but i'm really just not sure. Are they intended to be fangs? Maybe, maybe not. If i saw better photos or had it in hand perhaps i would see it differently.
And then there is the head dress. I just don't think i have ever seen a raksasa (or what we collectors generally consider raksasa) with such an elaborate head dress or crown. It's usually just long hair.

[Rick]

A couple of observations about the original hilt:

The little finger of the right hand seems disproportionately long with a wicked looking hooked nail.

What could be the semi spherical object be that is cradled in the right arm; the head of a child?

[Athanase]

Originally Posted by Rick

What could be the semi spherical object be that is cradled in the right arm; the head of a child?

For me it's his knee.

[Jean]

Originally Posted by Rick

A couple of observations about the original hilt:


What could be the semi spherical object be that is cradled in the right arm; the head of a child?

Hi Rick,
It seems to be his knee but it is not very clear as the foot is not shown
Regards

[kai]

Hello Rick and David,

That's definitely his knee: The traditional position of the right hand is the shin close to the knee (sometimes it pretty much covers the knee, too); the lower leg is visible (with only the feet hidden among the foliage). [The left hands usually rests on top of the left knee though.]

The pinky of the right hand always shows an extension which should be the long finger nail (these tend to curl towards the tip when growing longer; in this carving it's more pronounced than usual). [On the left hand, the thumb usually shows what seems to be an extended finger nail...]

Those are definitely fangs if you compare them with less stylized examples; even in this more stylized representation the animal-like, flared lips are clearly visible around the fangs (indicated by the traditional "striped" area).

Regards,
Kai