Balinese Barong Handle

Gustav · 21st July 2017, 11:07 PM

Alan, I also think that the carving of the lions head is of very good quality, with many small, crisp details, yet the parts below are not so accurate in execution. The difference is rather noticeable. And like you, I also suppose, it comes from Bali.

A. G. Maisey · 21st July 2017, 11:21 PM

Re the lion head, yes, similarities, and I have seen these kastane hilts.

I don't have time at the moment, but I'll see if I can find some Siamese pics that influenced my feelings.

Re the variation of the motifs in execution, what I think I can see is perhaps a photo problem. This thing might look a bit different in the hand.

Gustav · 21st July 2017, 11:42 PM

The best picture technically is the first one. The difference in carving quality between the parts to me seems noticeable.

Of course, the lions head isn't exact copy of a Kastane, that surely wasn't attempted, and isn't possible (see Malayan and Indonesian Tajong hilts). Yet the model for it with some certainty was a Kastane handle. If the model was a picture of a Kastane (most likely), the similarity, of course, will be the greatest in profile.

Battara · 22nd July 2017, 12:32 AM

I was thinking the same thing about the mix and Sinhalese lion attribution.

alexish · 22nd July 2017, 04:04 AM

Dear forum members,

Thank you so much for all your insightful comments. Now I understand where the design of my barong handle came form.

I also enclose pictures of another handle that I had earlier bought from the same dealer in Bali at a slightly cheaper price.

Not sure whether it resembles a lion or dragon? Perhaps it is also inspired by the Sinhala kastane sword?

A. G. Maisey · 22nd July 2017, 09:26 AM

Yes, there is a noticeable difference in sharpness of detail between the head and the body of the hilt, but before I put it down to execution I would need to have it in my hand.

Balinese carving is rarely the work of a single person, it is usually a group effort, with people of varying degrees of skill being assigned different asks in completion of a whole, so what we are seeing here could well be because of that group involvement. Something to be expected, that does not speak against Balinese origin, but rather gives weight to that opinion.

Still, for me I still have a question in my mind about the lion head. Yes, there is similarity with that well known kastane for. No argument. But browsing pics of other SE Asian art works does not yet convince me that the model for that hilt was of Ceylonese origin.

Gustav · 22nd July 2017, 10:08 AM

Alan, I am not sure if we could find an SEA art work with greater likeness to it then the lions head on a Kastane handle.

A. G. Maisey · 22nd July 2017, 12:43 PM

Sure, maybe not.

21st July 2017, 11:07 PM	#1
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	Alan, I also think that the carving of the lions head is of very good quality, with many small, crisp details, yet the parts below are not so accurate in execution. The difference is rather noticeable. And like you, I also suppose, it comes from Bali. Attached Images Last edited by Gustav; 21st July 2017 at 11:19 PM.

21st July 2017, 11:42 PM	#3
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	The best picture technically is the first one. The difference in carving quality between the parts to me seems noticeable. Of course, the lions head isn't exact copy of a Kastane, that surely wasn't attempted, and isn't possible (see Malayan and Indonesian Tajong hilts). Yet the model for it with some certainty was a Kastane handle. If the model was a picture of a Kastane (most likely), the similarity, of course, will be the greatest in profile. Attached Images

22nd July 2017, 04:04 AM	#5
alexish Member Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 127	Another lion hilt from same dealer Dear forum members, Thank you so much for all your insightful comments. Now I understand where the design of my barong handle came form. I also enclose pictures of another handle that I had earlier bought from the same dealer in Bali at a slightly cheaper price. Not sure whether it resembles a lion or dragon? Perhaps it is also inspired by the Sinhala kastane sword? Attached Images

21st July 2017, 11:21 PM	#2
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Re the lion head, yes, similarities, and I have seen these kastane hilts. I don't have time at the moment, but I'll see if I can find some Siamese pics that influenced my feelings. Re the variation of the motifs in execution, what I think I can see is perhaps a photo problem. This thing might look a bit different in the hand.

22nd July 2017, 12:32 AM	#4
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	I was thinking the same thing about the mix and Sinhalese lion attribution.

22nd July 2017, 09:26 AM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Yes, there is a noticeable difference in sharpness of detail between the head and the body of the hilt, but before I put it down to execution I would need to have it in my hand. Balinese carving is rarely the work of a single person, it is usually a group effort, with people of varying degrees of skill being assigned different asks in completion of a whole, so what we are seeing here could well be because of that group involvement. Something to be expected, that does not speak against Balinese origin, but rather gives weight to that opinion. Still, for me I still have a question in my mind about the lion head. Yes, there is similarity with that well known kastane for. No argument. But browsing pics of other SE Asian art works does not yet convince me that the model for that hilt was of Ceylonese origin.

22nd July 2017, 10:08 AM	#7
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	Alan, I am not sure if we could find an SEA art work with greater likeness to it then the lions head on a Kastane handle.

22nd July 2017, 12:43 PM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,991	Sure, maybe not.