Food For Thought

ariel · 27th February 2006, 04:07 PM

We, sword collectors, think that our acquisition of things sharp and pointy is a form of investment. Indeed, the prices went up and up for many years.
However, this article offers a sobering thought: if there are no buyers, there is no value.
Sword collection is more than just amassing used lottery tickers: it requires familiarity and appreciation of history in all its manifestations. The coming generations have not been educated the way we were (for better or for worse!) and history is not their forte. They grew up with the idea that there are "generations" of things(computers, tapes/DVDs, TVs etc, etc) and that with the advent of a new "generation", the earlier one becomes obsolete and needs to be discarded.
The idea of "obsolescence" is a death sentence of collecting!
Since most people start collecting when they are financially stable (~ 40-50 yo), the guy who would be potentially interested in paying a lot of money for my swords 20 years down the road, must be in his mid-20s, ie in college, right now. How many history-minded college students do you know?
I am afraid, my swords will decrease in value 5 years down the road and will be worthless by the time I hit the retirement age.

Valjhun · 27th February 2006, 05:10 PM

As Ariel said our kind of collecting is a sort of investment.

However I dissagree with him about the value decrease in the future. I honestly think that thoose nowdays kids who play games like Prince of Persia, Berserk, Ninja Gaiden ecc. and watch moovies like KillBill, Last Samurai ecc. at a certain age will be enthusiastic to buy some stuff they saw in thoose beloved games/films and they'll be prepared to pay big bucks for it (even more than we do today, 'cos we/you weren't not so much under the affect of the mass-media ;o). I think that interest in collecting will fall over the years, but the number of people who will be enraptured to put a pair of katana or shamshir on the wall will drastically increase due to thoose movies and games.

Beeig myself still pretty young (I've just turned 26 and I still play games and I'm certainlly not ashamed of that) I can confirm that all my coevals are shocked upon my collection. Further, I was selling a 3000$ katana made by osafune sukesada the previous week and I've sold it just yesterday to a pampered youngser just yesterday for a double price. When he saw my little collection he almost felt to a down, he wanted my 13 Luk Keris so badly, 'cos he had seen it in Prince of Persia (yes, games are sometimes stupid), but unfortunatelly it wasn't for sale

(I regret it a little, thou).

So do not underestmate the power of modern media... Just take a look at the big bucks United Cuttlery and other licenciaries are doing by producing and selling sword and other regalia from the films. I guess that someone would be prepared to buy a real japanese gunto (also appeared in many movies) rather that thoose modern made trash, if he would KNOW that he can get it for just the double price...

Well I also predict an even greater increase of Nazi and Soviet memorabilia. Why? Well I guess that bad guys were always and will be for ever verry popular.

On the other hand I'm almost certain that stamps, coins, or more "stupid" things like pencils and lottery tickets or antique toalette paper (what the hell???) and all that meaningless stuff will fall into oblivion sooner or later.

Well, for the end, if you, older collectors have probblems with afterdeath disposal of your collections, I offer volounteer to take it over and I promise to maintain your collections properly

Lew · 27th February 2006, 06:04 PM

I have it covered for now. My 14yr old has already picked out all my prime pieces and told me when I kick off he is going to take over my collection

That is if I don't have them buried with me I told him.

Lew

Jens Nordlunde · 27th February 2006, 06:24 PM

Hi Rick,

In a way Ariel is right, but on the other hand – and I think all collectors should realise this – what we have, all of it is on loan. On loan for further generations.

Tim Simmons · 27th February 2006, 07:03 PM

I think some collecting really does verge on "OCD" and when these collections lack any distinguishing merit their future may well be in doubt or become a museum of curio, I am afiad I might see pencils that way even if some are quite old. As for the things we collect, so long as our societies remain and others attain wealth to enable collecting I am sure the interest is constant. Youngsters grow up and anything can become the catalyst. Just look at some of the lovely young ladies fresh from university that one sees presenting historical documentaries and the like on TV. Tim

Jim McDougall · 28th February 2006, 12:36 AM

I'm having a pyramid built, and they'll all be buried with me

!!!!

Jim-Ra

Seriously, I agree with Jens and I hope that any legacy I leave will be that I did something to help preserve the history of these weapons, and the researchers of the next generation will carry forward and love these weapons as I have.

Rick · 28th February 2006, 01:50 AM

I believe that as weapon collectors we have a somewhat different niche than the people who collect Avon bottles or match holders .

I would like to believe that the historical and , dare I say it, visceral attraction of these pieces will serve them well in retaining their value and collector interest over the forthcoming generations .

What I fear the most is the threat of the burgeoning legal sanctions against the posession of these items for future generations . A casual glance at some nations' weapons laws today speaks volumes for our future prospects .

After all a well preserved 18th century sword or dagger in the wrong hands will still be able to take a life in the 22nd century .

Andrew · 28th February 2006, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

I'm having a pyramid built, and they'll all be buried with me

!!!!

Jim-Ra

Seriously, I agree with Jens and I hope that any legacy I leave will be that I did something to help preserve the history of these weapons, and the researchers of the next generation will carry forward and love these weapons as I have.

You, too.

Andrew · 28th February 2006, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jens Nordlunde

Hi Rick,

In a way Ariel is right, but on the other hand – and I think all collectors should realise this – what we have, all of it is on loan. On loan for further generations.

I'm a generation removed from you, Jens.

(In case you need a home for your collection one day.

)

manicdj · 12th March 2006, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valjhun

As Ariel said our kind of collecting is a sort of investment.

However I dissagree with him about the value decrease in the future. I honestly think that thoose nowdays kids who play games like Prince of Persia, Berserk, Ninja Gaiden ecc. and watch moovies like KillBill, Last Samurai ecc. at a certain age will be enthusiastic to buy some stuff they saw in thoose beloved games/films and they'll be prepared to pay big bucks for it (even more than we do today, 'cos we/you weren't not so much under the affect of the mass-media ;o). I think that interest in collecting will fall over the years, but the number of people who will be enraptured to put a pair of katana or shamshir on the wall will drastically increase due to thoose movies and games.

Beeig myself still pretty young (I've just turned 26 and I still play games and I'm certainlly not ashamed of that) I can confirm that all my coevals are shocked upon my collection. Further, I was selling a 3000$ katana made by osafune sukesada the previous week and I've sold it just yesterday to a pampered youngser just yesterday for a double price. When he saw my little collection he almost felt to a down, he wanted my 13 Luk Keris so badly, 'cos he had seen it in Prince of Persia (yes, games are sometimes stupid), but unfortunatelly it wasn't for sale

(I regret it a little, thou).

So do not underestmate the power of modern media... Just take a look at the big bucks United Cuttlery and other licenciaries are doing by producing and selling sword and other regalia from the films. I guess that someone would be prepared to buy a real japanese gunto (also appeared in many movies) rather that thoose modern made trash, if he would KNOW that he can get it for just the double price...

Well I also predict an even greater increase of Nazi and Soviet memorabilia. Why? Well I guess that bad guys were always and will be for ever verry popular.

On the other hand I'm almost certain that stamps, coins, or more "stupid" things like pencils and lottery tickets or antique toalette paper (what the hell???) and all that meaningless stuff will fall into oblivion sooner or later.

Well, for the end, if you, older collectors have probblems with afterdeath disposal of your collections, I offer volounteer to take it over and I promise to maintain your collections properly

I agree with the above, And the sobering thought is this,, for the kid's of today's age of teck toy's and gadgets, what will they do with sharp and pointy things they buy ?

Tim Simmons · 13th March 2006, 05:14 PM

Another angle, if society is to assume civilisation, culture and indeed wealth continues on a upward curved graph line then with most of the artifacts we collect particularly the really "ethnic" stuff will become more and more objects from another world. People will never loose the fascination for these things. Just look at the demand for repro stuff of various qualities, often the same price and not infrequently a lot more than the real thing. Tim

27th February 2006, 05:10 PM	#2
Valjhun Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 692	What a "youngster" has to say As Ariel said our kind of collecting is a sort of investment. However I dissagree with him about the value decrease in the future. I honestly think that thoose nowdays kids who play games like Prince of Persia, Berserk, Ninja Gaiden ecc. and watch moovies like KillBill, Last Samurai ecc. at a certain age will be enthusiastic to buy some stuff they saw in thoose beloved games/films and they'll be prepared to pay big bucks for it (even more than we do today, 'cos we/you weren't not so much under the affect of the mass-media ;o). I think that interest in collecting will fall over the years, but the number of people who will be enraptured to put a pair of katana or shamshir on the wall will drastically increase due to thoose movies and games. Beeig myself still pretty young (I've just turned 26 and I still play games and I'm certainlly not ashamed of that) I can confirm that all my coevals are shocked upon my collection. Further, I was selling a 3000$ katana made by osafune sukesada the previous week and I've sold it just yesterday to a pampered youngser just yesterday for a double price. When he saw my little collection he almost felt to a down, he wanted my 13 Luk Keris so badly, 'cos he had seen it in Prince of Persia (yes, games are sometimes stupid), but unfortunatelly it wasn't for sale (I regret it a little, thou). So do not underestmate the power of modern media... Just take a look at the big bucks United Cuttlery and other licenciaries are doing by producing and selling sword and other regalia from the films. I guess that someone would be prepared to buy a real japanese gunto (also appeared in many movies) rather that thoose modern made trash, if he would KNOW that he can get it for just the double price... Well I also predict an even greater increase of Nazi and Soviet memorabilia. Why? Well I guess that bad guys were always and will be for ever verry popular. On the other hand I'm almost certain that stamps, coins, or more "stupid" things like pencils and lottery tickets or antique toalette paper (what the hell???) and all that meaningless stuff will fall into oblivion sooner or later. Well, for the end, if you, older collectors have probblems with afterdeath disposal of your collections, I offer volounteer to take it over and I promise to maintain your collections properly Last edited by Valjhun; 27th February 2006 at 05:43 PM.

27th February 2006, 04:07 PM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	We, sword collectors, think that our acquisition of things sharp and pointy is a form of investment. Indeed, the prices went up and up for many years. However, this article offers a sobering thought: if there are no buyers, there is no value. Sword collection is more than just amassing used lottery tickers: it requires familiarity and appreciation of history in all its manifestations. The coming generations have not been educated the way we were (for better or for worse!) and history is not their forte. They grew up with the idea that there are "generations" of things(computers, tapes/DVDs, TVs etc, etc) and that with the advent of a new "generation", the earlier one becomes obsolete and needs to be discarded. The idea of "obsolescence" is a death sentence of collecting! Since most people start collecting when they are financially stable (~ 40-50 yo), the guy who would be potentially interested in paying a lot of money for my swords 20 years down the road, must be in his mid-20s, ie in college, right now. How many history-minded college students do you know? I am afraid, my swords will decrease in value 5 years down the road and will be worthless by the time I hit the retirement age.

27th February 2006, 06:04 PM	#3
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	I have it covered for now. My 14yr old has already picked out all my prime pieces and told me when I kick off he is going to take over my collection That is if I don't have them buried with me I told him. Lew

27th February 2006, 06:24 PM	#4
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Hi Rick, In a way Ariel is right, but on the other hand – and I think all collectors should realise this – what we have, all of it is on loan. On loan for further generations.

27th February 2006, 07:03 PM	#5
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,875	I think some collecting really does verge on "OCD" and when these collections lack any distinguishing merit their future may well be in doubt or become a museum of curio, I am afiad I might see pencils that way even if some are quite old. As for the things we collect, so long as our societies remain and others attain wealth to enable collecting I am sure the interest is constant. Youngsters grow up and anything can become the catalyst. Just look at some of the lovely young ladies fresh from university that one sees presenting historical documentaries and the like on TV. Tim

28th February 2006, 12:36 AM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,453	I'm having a pyramid built, and they'll all be buried with me !!!! Jim-Ra Seriously, I agree with Jens and I hope that any legacy I leave will be that I did something to help preserve the history of these weapons, and the researchers of the next generation will carry forward and love these weapons as I have.

28th February 2006, 01:50 AM	#7
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,347	I believe that as weapon collectors we have a somewhat different niche than the people who collect Avon bottles or match holders . I would like to believe that the historical and , dare I say it, visceral attraction of these pieces will serve them well in retaining their value and collector interest over the forthcoming generations . What I fear the most is the threat of the burgeoning legal sanctions against the posession of these items for future generations . A casual glance at some nations' weapons laws today speaks volumes for our future prospects . After all a well preserved 18th century sword or dagger in the wrong hands will still be able to take a life in the 22nd century .

13th March 2006, 05:14 PM	#11
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,875	Another angle, if society is to assume civilisation, culture and indeed wealth continues on a upward curved graph line then with most of the artifacts we collect particularly the really "ethnic" stuff will become more and more objects from another world. People will never loose the fascination for these things. Just look at the demand for repro stuff of various qualities, often the same price and not infrequently a lot more than the real thing. Tim