Ottoman bulbous barel wall musket

[Oliver Pinchot]

Great find, Eftihis.
It retains most of the characteristics of the Catalonian guns from which it is derived. This form of muzzle is called "lale" (la-LEH) or tulip. Most barrels were heavily reinforced at breech and muzzle to keep them from exploding in use; past a certain point, it simply became stylistic. Persian, Indian, and other barrels often show this trait as well (or similarly, a substantial flare, with or without some sort of animal or monster head.)

Please show a pic of the right side of the butt all the way up to the lock.

[eftihis]

Here in Greece we call tradititionaly this type of barel "armuti" from the turkish word "armut"=pear (due to shape). Below is a graf from the "Marsili Luigi F. - Stato militare dell'impero ottomano" In the bottom low is a barel with this bulbous end.

[Philip]

Originally Posted by Oliver Pinchot

Great find, Eftihis.
It retains most of the characteristics of the Catalonian guns from which it is derived.

I disagree. The shoulder stocks on long guns characteristic of Cataluña have a distinct "boot shaped" profile, with a prominent angular "toe". Very early ones were of elliptical section but soon the characteristic cross-section became flattened, with squared-off bottom contour. See this photoprint from W Keith Neal's Spanish Guns and Pistols showing the progression over quite a long time, speaking to the longevity of this very conservative design in Spain.,

The stock of the gun under discussion here is a design originating in the gunmaking center of Brescia, in the Italian region of Lombardy. Compare the profile of the gun on this thread to these line drawings from Nolfo di Carpegna's Brescian Firearms. Note that this style comes in both elliptical and polygonal cross-sections. The profiles are rather consistent, and are distinct from those of Catalan guns. Looking at these, it's not hard to see where the design of the dzheferdar stock came from. Considering the role that the Republic of Venice played in the politics and economy of the Balkans and eastern Mediterranean for centuries, and the importance of the arms trade in its mercantile activities.

[eftihis]

The wheelock gun is from a museum in Croatia. They dont state if it is imported or localy nade. The other photo is of the Italian (Brescian i think) type, and finaly a similar shape described as turkish. It is obvious as you say where the dzheferdar style came from and this looks like a step before dzheferdar.

[Philip]

Originally Posted by eftihis

The wheelock gun is from a museum in Croatia. They dont state if it is imported or localy nade. The other photo is of the Italian (Brescian i think) type, and finaly a similar shape described as turkish. It is obvious as you say where the dzheferdar style came from and this looks like a step before dzheferdar.

Wonderful pics, thanks! The miquelet gun is a stylistic hybrid. The stock is classic Brescian, 16th-17th style used also with wheellocks, but the lock is a version of the miquelet developed in central Italy, called a Roman lock although there's no evidence that it was invented in Rome. You will note that this lock is mechanically different from the Spanish "patilla" type miquelet that we have been discussing. This is because its mainspring pushes down on the front of the cock, whereas the Spanish (and therefore Ottoman/Balkan/Persian) versions have the mainspring reversed, it pushes up on the rear of the cock, in order to do the same job. Also, the Roman and Spanish locks have a different system of sears, the little levers and wedges that control the cock and connect it to the trigger. I have not yet seen an Ottoman-made Roman lock. Probably it was not popular in Eastern countries because its sear system is more complex and requires greater skill to manufacture with the necessary precision. It also requires more careful maintenance.

It seems to me that the wheellock mechanism on the other gun is imported, perhaps from one of the Germanic countries. Again, I can't find convincing evidence of a wheellock being made in the Ottoman Empire, admittedly examples of any Otto gun with such a lock are not common but published examples all display imported locks. The same remarks apply to the gun with the Scandinavian / north European snap lock. These things do tell us something about the extent of trade between the Ottomans and the rest of Europe.

[eftihis]

I found these photos from Vienna museum, they are desxribed as 17th century guns.

[Philip]

Very nice, high quality and superb condition. Possible trophies taken during the 17th cent. wars against the Ottomans?