Plains stone axe for ?ing

[Tim Simmons]

Just want to add this as it is fun to read.

https://www.realorrepro.com/article/...dian-Artifacts

[VANDOO]

THE STONE PARTS OF NATIVE AMERICAN ARTIFACTS ARE BY NO MEANS RARE IN NORTH AND SOUTH AMERICA. WHEN YOU CONSIDER THE THOUSANDS OF YEARS AND THE UNTOLD MILLIONS OF TRIBESMEN IT IS NOT SURPRISING.
THERE ARE QUITE A FEW INTACT WAR CLUBS, SPEARS, SHIELDS, ROBES AND OTHER ARTIFACTS MOSTLY IN MUSEUMS OR PRIVATE COLLECTIONS. BUT THERE ARE MUCH LARGER NUMBERS OF THOSE WITH NO PROVENANCE THAT ARE MADE TO LOOK OLD TO SELL TO COLLECTORS OR FOR WESTERN DECOR. THIS HAS BEING GOING ON FOR A VERY LONG TIME AND IS STILL DONE TODAY. I KNOW QUITE A FEW WHO DO THIS LOCALLY AND IN TEXAS. THERE IS NO SHORTAGE OF EXCELLENT FLINT NAPPERS THAT CAN REPLICATE JUST ABOUT ANYTHING AS WELL AS MANY MORE WHO CAN TURN OUT DECENT POINTS BUT NO MASTERPIECES. WE JUST HAD OUR YEARLY POINT AND FOSSIL SHOW HERE IN TULSA YESTERDAY AND THERE WERE THOUSANDS OF ARTIFACTS FOR SALE. MOST AT THIS SHOW ARE AUTHENTIC OR IF RECENT WORK SOLD AS SUCH. WE HAVE MANY EXPERTS ON HAND SO IT WOULD NOT BE EASY TO GET AWAY WITH BRINGING FAKES TO SELL. AT FLEA MARKETS AND GUN SHOWS THAT IS NOT THE CASE SO LOTS OF THIS TYPE OF ITEM CAN BE FOUND FOR SALE ALONG WITH THE OCCASIONAL REAL ITEMS. WE COULD SEPARATE THESE COMPLETELY INTACT ITEMS INTO SEVERAL CATEGORY'S.
#1. AUTHENTIC ARTIFACTS INTACT AND WITH GOOD PROVENIENCE
#2. AUTHENTIC ARTIFACTS INTACT ,DOUBTFUL OR NO PROVENIENCE
#3. AUTHENTIC STONE BLADE OR POINTS WITH A RESTORED HANDLE ALL
DONE USING THE PROPER OLD TECHNIQUES AND MATERIALS.
#4. AUTHENTIC STONE BUT MODERN TECHNIQUES AND MATERIALS USED
FOR THE RESTORATION.
#5. ITEMS MADE USING TRADITIONAL MATERIALS AND TECHNIQUES MADE
BY NATIVE AMERICANS FOR PERSONAL OR CEREMONIAL USE WITHIN THE
TRIBE IN RECENT TIMES.
#6.WELL MADE REPLICAS BY NATIVE AMERICANS IN THE PAST FOR WILD
WEST SHOWS OR FOR SALE TO THOSE WHO TRAVEL.
THESE FIRST SIX ARE GOOD COLLECTIBLES IN A ETHNOGRAPHIC SENSE WITH AT LEAST SOME ORIGINAL PARTS OR TRIBAL CONNECTIONS.
#7. POORLY MADE REPLICAS, MADE IN THE PAST BY NATIVE AMERICANS
FOR SALE IN SOUVENIR SHOPS.
#8. REPLICAS WITH ALL NEW MATERIALS SOLD PRIMARILY FOR
DECORATIONS.
#9. ITEMS MADE AND ANTIQUED TO FOOL COLLECTORS INTO THINKING
THEY ARE AUTHENTIC THESE ARE MADE BY NATIVE AMERICAN AS
WELL AS OTHERS AND ARE INTENTIONAL FRAUDS AT LEAST BY THE
MAKERS. AT TIMES THE RE SELLERS DO NOT KNOW OR PERHAPS DON'T
CARE.
ONE FELLOW I KNOW LOOKS NATIVE AMERICAN BUT IS NOT AND SPECIALIZES IN BUYING CHEAP OLD LONG GUNS, ADDING SOME RAWHIDE, PAINT BEADS AND FEATHERS AND A FEW ANTIQUES BRASS TACKS. HIS WORK LOOKS VERY GOOD AND HE HAS NO TROUBLE FINDING BUYERS WHO ARE MOSTLY DEALERS IN SUCH ITEMS. HE ALSO MAKES UP A GOOD STORY TO GO WITH EACH ITEM.
MY PERSONAL WAY OF DEALING WITH THIS IS ALL STONE POINTS ARE DOUBTFUL UNLESS I FIND THEM MYSELF OR A TRUSTED FRIEND FINDS THEM. THOSE WITH PAPERS BY AN EXPERT I KNOW PERSONALLY ARE LIKELY GOOD. EVERYTHING ELSE IS SUSPECT BUT IF I SEE SOMETHING I LIKE AT A FAIR PRICE I WILL BUY IT ANYWAY. EVEN EXPERIENCED COLLECTORS ARE NEVER PERFECT ALL THE TIME, BUT THAT IS PART OF THE ADVENTURE OF COLLECTING.

[mross]

Tim, looks like you have it bad. Welcome to the wonderful world of artifact collecting. I am on this forum occasionally, yes I am one of the collectors you mentioned in your first post. Here is a link to another forum that specializes in your new obsession.

http://www.arrowheadology.com/

[Tim Simmons]

Thank you for that link. Provides a great deal of food for thought. Yes faking and reproductions add to collecting problems. The foul cry fake is a way to end any real investigation. I often think especially where an object does not clearly fit in " fake " category who really has the authority and ultimate knowledge. Those who have been in the scene for a long time and gain a kind of following and often dealership never seem to have fakes . Only you as a newbie or potential customer wanting to perhaps make a trade. I came across a very interesting Web page about ancient Peru ceramics. The jist of it was some experts are actually gaining their knowledge and expertise on fakes. I will add it when I find it again.

[mross]

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

Thank you for that link. Provides a great deal of food for thought. Yes faking and reproductions add to collecting problems. The foul cry fake is a way to end any real investigation. I often think especially where an object does not clearly fit in " fake " category who really has the authority and ultimate knowledge. Those who have been in the scene for a long time and gain a kind of following and often dealership never seem to have fakes . Only you as a newbie or potential customer wanting to perhaps make a trade. I came across a very interesting Web page about ancient Peru ceramics. The jist of it was some experts are actually gaining their knowledge and expertise on fakes. I will add it when I find it again.

If you want to get really crazy here is progression for your consideration.
1)Total fake modern made.
2)Real broken artifact made into something new;
a) Made into something new in modern times
b) Made into something "new" in ancient times.
3)Real artifact made into something new
a) Modified by modern man
b) Modified by ancient man - if you want to see a artifact collector cry show him a clovis point made into something else.
4)Real artifact "enhanced"
a) Enhanced by modern man -this could be anything from resharpening to fixing a base to augmenting serrations.
b) Enhanced by ancient man -see above.
So where do you draw the line? If you think any of these things are easy to detect I refer you to "Authenticating Ancient Indian Artifacts, How to recognize reproduction and altered artifacts" by Jim Bennett

[Tim Simmons]

Well there is just as equal chance that by luck or judgment or long observation and museum pounding that you just got it right '

[Tim Simmons]

Another potential fake. Better pictures when I have it.