Classifying shashka--a serious discussion of typology

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by ariel

Eric,
I thought my summary was clear. Sorry if I was not more explicit.

I think that Bukharan saber has nothing to do genetically with the Caucasian/ Cossack examples. What unites them is just a superficial similarity, a consequence of parallel development. I would tentatively suggest that the Bukharan example and the Khyber ( as well as Khyber-like Turkmen and Uzbek bladed weapons) all stem from the same proto-group.

On the other hand, the military Afghan " pseudoshashka" shares so much with the Caucasian/Cossack one, that denying the influence of the latter on the former would be incorrect. Whether the original, pre-Cossack Afghani guardless saber existed and how it looked, is a matter of conjecture.

Ariel,

Firstly, I'd like to clarify my Yataghan reference in relation to Bukhara sabres of the form discussed. It is not any grip slab shape that I refer to but the distance and subtitles of how far the ears protrude beyond the grip straps on known Bukhara examples when so many are simply flush. The Bukhara typology can be drilled down in various degrees.

Central Asia, Caucasian mountains and China have all had a long long long history of guardless sabres and swords, there is nothing new here as history has taught us, and I do not ever recall ever hearing these ancient sword types referred to as Shashka. So with reference to history, and the centuries past, I wholeheartedly agree that the Bukahara sabres do not belong even as a subgroup of a relatively modern term "Shashka".

These long straight knife types from Bukhara, and shallow curved sabres, are far more Turkish Yataghan and Persian Shamshir in regards manufacture of the hilt, (not appearance) ... With reference to blades, but of course disregarding Kopis types, but with consideration to those known with straight blades, a Turkish connection through Persia is far more probable that any Shashka. Also consider that Bukhara is Persian and the pointers along the silk road routes. How a shallow curved blade also ended up in these hilt styles is easy to see when next to their small utility knives which has been touched on.

For consideration to Afghanistan sabres in question, A quick look will also see many of these straight bladed Yataghans, have but a long bolster and similar rivet structure seen on the Aghan "pseudo Shashka". These same Yataghan also carry the same "ear" types as these sabres too.
Note also, there are Khyber knives with pommel forms also seen on some Yataghan...just to muddy the waters some more ... And to simply ask, where do these clear visual and construction aspects of Turkish Yataghan leave leave the idea of trying to classify anything other than a Shashka from the Caucasian Mountains, as it as known, as being the only Shashka...it is a unique sabre unto itself in many ways.

Gavin

[ariel]

Gavin,
I am glad we agree on the lack of relation between the Bukharan and the Caucasian examples and on the uniqueness of Shashka as a separate, Sui Generis, type of guardless sabers.

We have neither physical nor iconographic examples of Caucasian shashkas older than late 18th- early 19 century. Nobody knows whether this is due to their late appearance, to the multiple reuses or just losses of the old examples or simply to the lack of "iconographers". I discount here the so-called "parsunas" ( bastardized " person" ), rather primitive portraits of Cossack atamans of late 18 century, wearing fully-developed shashkas with typical Circassian pommel decorations simply because they were painted posthumously.

But let me offer a somewhat heretical idea: Caucasian shashka owes its genesis to Ottoman yataghans. Crimea was an outcropping of the Ottoman Empire, had documented yataghans early on and was supplying a lot of weapons to Circassians. In turn, Circassia, a vassal of the Crimean Khanate, was a secondary vassal of the Ottomans. Also, Georgian kingdoms were in an on-and-off state of war with Turkey and were often controlled by it . One can easily imagine that they could have adopted the eared handle ( simplifying it to the hilt, pun intended) and marrying it to their familiar saber blade, creating a cheap, simple and much more functional weapon. The adoption of such a "hybrid" might have been facilitated by the already present Western Georgian sabers without a guard ( see works of Vakhtang Kiziria)

As to the "eared" pommels of Afghani pseudoshashkas, they are just a narrow cleft ( very Caucasian) rather than widely spread Ottoman. And their suspension system is purely Caucasian/Cossack, not a "tucked-under-the-belt" Ottoman. Moreover, their appearance tightly follows Russian occupation of Central Asian Khanates and stationing of Cossack cavalry there. The Ottomans had only limited if any influence in Central Asia at that time.

At the end of the day, we can only hope that this issue will be specifically addressed by the Caucasian historians and ethnographers, and there are brilliant people there! Not much hope for the Afghani contribution, though....

[Andreas]

Originally Posted by ariel

We have neither physical nor iconographic examples of Caucasian shashkas older than late 18th- early 19 century.

Buttin in his catalogue shows a shashka with a 16th century Genoese blade (No 646 below). He says that these Genoese blades were the most prized in the Caucasus, a fact which led to Syrian forgeries, but of a far lesser quality.
Andreas

[ariel]

Originally Posted by Andreas

Buttin in his catalogue shows a shashka with a 16th century Genoese blade (No 646 below). He says that these Genoese blades were the most prized in the Caucasus, a fact which led to Syrian forgeries, but of a far lesser quality.
Andreas

Andreas,

100% correct observation.
But old blades were mounted and remounted over and over again on Caucasian shashkas.

They were indeed highly valuable, and the term "gurda" was related to the Genoese "jaws" mark. Just like "ters maimal" ( screaming, or crazy, ape) defined a blade with the originally German ( (Passau) running wolf. Most were locally made and the variations of either mark fill large illustrations in the book by Astvatsaturyan.

~18th century German blades with elaborate depictions of "man in the moon" and arm with a sword coming from a cloud for some reason were locally called Abbas Mirza. Go figure:-))

Regretfully, there is not a single example of a 16-18 century blade mounted on contemporaneous handle, and the latter is what largely defines a shashka.

[Andreas]

Originally Posted by ariel

But old blades were mounted and remounted over and over again on Caucasian shashkas.

Of course, as with swords everywhere. But if that is the case here, I wonder for what type of sword would a blade with these characteristics originally be intended for? (sorry but I don't have the time to translate right now)
Andreas

Buttin's description:
646. — SABRE DU CAUCASE (Chacheka), XVIle-XVIII, siècle. (Pl. XX).Belle lame du xvie siècle, légèrement cintrée et finissant en langue de carpe. Large de 0,03 au talon sur 17 cm. elle est à ce point, par un brusque rétrécissement au dos, ramenée à 0,027. Trois gouttières jusqu'à ce rétrécissement, puis ensuite deux jusqu'à 0,20 de la pointe. A partir de cette longueur, la lame devient à deux tranchants et n'a plus qu'une gouttière qui s'arrête à 0,10 de la pointe pour lui laisser toute sa force.Sur le côté droit le poinçon de Gênes, qui est la marque la plus estimée au Caucase.Aussi a-t-il été très copié par la contrefaçon syrienne, mais les lames génoises, surtout celles du xvie siècle, sont bien plus belles de qualité, ont les gouttières plus régulières et les intervalles qui les séparent sont plus étroits et finissent en arête vive. La pointe parfaitement calculée est assez en arrière pour permettre le coup d'estramaçon et en même temps assez aiguë pour permettre le coup de pointe, chose rare dans les chachekas. Poignée d'une seule pièce, en corne noire, sans garde, formant crosse en bec au pommeau pour retenir la main, et fendue en 2 lobes ou oreilles comme celle des yatagans, mais bien plus rapprochées. C'est la forme typique de la poignée de chacheka.Fourreau en chagrin vert, sans garniture et destiné à être passé dans la ceinture. La poignée y entre à demi.Arme ancienne, de conservation parfaite, et à laquelle la qualité incomparable de l'acier de sa lame donnerait aujourd'hui encore une grande valeur au Caucase.C'est une des meilleures lames de notre collection. Long. : 0,940. Lame : 0,810.

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by Andreas

Of course, as with swords everywhere. But if that is the case here, I wonder for what type of sword would a blade with these characteristics originally be intended for? (sorry but I don't have the time to translate right now)
Andreas

Buttin's description:
646. — SABRE DU CAUCASE (Chacheka), XVIle-XVIII, siècle. (Pl. XX).Belle lame du xvie siècle, légèrement cintrée et finissant en langue de carpe. Large de 0,03 au talon sur 17 cm. elle est à ce point, par un brusque rétrécissement au dos, ramenée à 0,027. Trois gouttières jusqu'à ce rétrécissement, puis ensuite deux jusqu'à 0,20 de la pointe. A partir de cette longueur, la lame devient à deux tranchants et n'a plus qu'une gouttière qui s'arrête à 0,10 de la pointe pour lui laisser toute sa force.Sur le côté droit le poinçon de Gênes, qui est la marque la plus estimée au Caucase.Aussi a-t-il été très copié par la contrefaçon syrienne, mais les lames génoises, surtout celles du xvie siècle, sont bien plus belles de qualité, ont les gouttières plus régulières et les intervalles qui les séparent sont plus étroits et finissent en arête vive. La pointe parfaitement calculée est assez en arrière pour permettre le coup d'estramaçon et en même temps assez aiguë pour permettre le coup de pointe, chose rare dans les chachekas. Poignée d'une seule pièce, en corne noire, sans garde, formant crosse en bec au pommeau pour retenir la main, et fendue en 2 lobes ou oreilles comme celle des yatagans, mais bien plus rapprochées. C'est la forme typique de la poignée de chacheka.Fourreau en chagrin vert, sans garniture et destiné à être passé dans la ceinture. La poignée y entre à demi.Arme ancienne, de conservation parfaite, et à laquelle la qualité incomparable de l'acier de sa lame donnerait aujourd'hui encore une grande valeur au Caucase.C'est une des meilleures lames de notre collection. Long. : 0,940. Lame : 0,810.

646. - SABRE CAUCASUS (Chacheka), seventeenth-eighteenth century. (Pl. XX) .Beautiful blade of the sixteenth century, slightly curved and ending in language carp. 0.03 off the heel of 17 cm. it is at this point, by a sudden narrowing of the back, reduced to 0.027. Three gutters until shrinkage, then two up to 0.20 of the tip. From this length, the blade is double-edged and has only one channel which stops at 0.10 tip to give him all his force.Sur the right punch of Genoa, which is the most esteemed brand has Caucase.Aussi he was very copied by Syrian infringement, but the Genoese blades, especially those of the sixteenth century are much more beautiful in quality, have more regular gutters and the intervals separate are narrower and end in sharp edge. The perfectly calculated tip is enough back to allow the kick-edged swords and even enough time for the acute point shot, rare in chachekas. Handle one piece, black horn, without warning, forming butt spout knob to hold his hand, and split into two lobes or ears like yataghans, but closer. This is the typical form of the handle chacheka.Fourreau green grief without trim and intended to be spent in the belt. The handle is in between old demi.Arme of perfect preservation, and to which the incomparable quality of its steel blade still give great value to Caucase.C'est the best blades of our collection. Long. : 0,940. Blade: 0,810.

[ariel]

Andreas,
Obviously, there were no shashkas in Europe; such blades were used for mass manufacture of garden variety sabers, with handguards and all.

But there was a whole industry in Italy, Germany and Styria producing blades for export to the Orient. And the final product was determined by the end user: the same blade could have become shashka in Caucasus, tulwar in India, nimcha in Morocco etc. They were hugely popular everywhere and the natives quickly caught the drift and started making imitations locally and even putting European marks on them.

[Andreas]

Originally Posted by Gavin Nugent

646. - SABRE CAUCASUS (Chacheka), seventeenth-eighteenth century. (Pl. XX) .Beautiful blade of the sixteenth century, slightly curved and ending in language carp. 0.03 off the heel of 17 cm. it is at this point, by a sudden narrowing of the back, reduced to 0.027. Three gutters until shrinkage, then two up to 0.20 of the tip. From this length, the blade is double-edged and has only one channel which stops at 0.10 tip to give him all his force.Sur the right punch of Genoa, which is the most esteemed brand has Caucase.Aussi he was very copied by Syrian infringement, but the Genoese blades, especially those of the sixteenth century are much more beautiful in quality, have more regular gutters and the intervals separate are narrower and end in sharp edge. The perfectly calculated tip is enough back to allow the kick-edged swords and even enough time for the acute point shot, rare in chachekas. Handle one piece, black horn, without warning, forming butt spout knob to hold his hand, and split into two lobes or ears like yataghans, but closer. This is the typical form of the handle chacheka.Fourreau green grief without trim and intended to be spent in the belt. The handle is in between old demi.Arme of perfect preservation, and to which the incomparable quality of its steel blade still give great value to Caucase.C'est the best blades of our collection. Long. : 0,940. Blade: 0,810.

Thank you Gavin, but automatic translation does have a tendency to produce a somewhat garbled result, to say the least...