Sumatran, Borneo or Moro???

VVV · 9th February 2006, 04:47 PM

Hi Rick,

I was of course referring to the other way around, the "Colonies" of Moros settling in Sumatra.
Let's see if somebody else has any new tracks and ideas?

Michael

Rick · 9th February 2006, 06:00 PM

Sorry Michael , my ignorance is showing .

I was unaware of the existence of Moro colonies in Sumatra ; would love to know more .

MABAGANI · 10th February 2006, 07:33 PM

The blade shape, forte and scabbard point towards a rehilt of a Moro spearhead. There's too much metal around the forte to be a cut down barung. I've seen this forte form on a kris shaped spear. Double edged barung usually go half or two thirds of the blade spine, this shape goes down much of the rear. The punto design is still consistent with Sulu ukkil and the horn ring is not uncommon. The pommel is odd in that it was made to match the hook on the blade, intentionally designed to show that it was not a traditional barung. Possibly retired to a sword or rehilted to look like a sword for trade, nicely done work. Thinking out loud, btw...lolz.

VVV · 10th February 2006, 10:05 PM

Hi Mabagani,

Interesting twist. "Recycled" spearhead swords seems to be common in f.i. Indonesia.
I am not so familiar with Moro spearheads so I have tried to find pictures of any resembling
this blade shape but couldn't.
Do you have any reference pictures?

Michael

Spunjer · 10th February 2006, 11:44 PM

michael,

check the last few posts on this thread...

http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001736.html

maybe Kino can repost his budiak?

btw, how wide is the blade???

VVV · 11th February 2006, 10:29 AM

Hi Spunjer,

It's 4,5 cm. Nice thread with some great spearheads, thanks.
And my blade is just slightly longer than the XXL Budiak posted.
I do have a Budiak so I put them next to each other.
From bird perspective I agree that there are some resemblance.
But looking from the side the Budiak resemblance is lost.
Also my blade has both a different tip and tang than a Budiak.
If you look at the blade thickness picture above it's obviously much flatter
than a Budiak and thinnest at its center.
Maybe Mabagani had another kind of spear in mind?

Michael

Dajak · 11th February 2006, 05:00 PM

Hi this is not from borneo the motifs on you can find on many weapons from malay indonesia there is no influence from Borneo on this Item

9th February 2006, 04:47 PM	#1
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Rick, I was of course referring to the other way around, the "Colonies" of Moros settling in Sumatra. Let's see if somebody else has any new tracks and ideas? Michael

9th February 2006, 06:00 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,378	Sorry Michael , my ignorance is showing . I was unaware of the existence of Moro colonies in Sumatra ; would love to know more .

10th February 2006, 07:33 PM	#3
MABAGANI Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 221	The blade shape, forte and scabbard point towards a rehilt of a Moro spearhead. There's too much metal around the forte to be a cut down barung. I've seen this forte form on a kris shaped spear. Double edged barung usually go half or two thirds of the blade spine, this shape goes down much of the rear. The punto design is still consistent with Sulu ukkil and the horn ring is not uncommon. The pommel is odd in that it was made to match the hook on the blade, intentionally designed to show that it was not a traditional barung. Possibly retired to a sword or rehilted to look like a sword for trade, nicely done work. Thinking out loud, btw...lolz.

10th February 2006, 10:05 PM	#4
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Mabagani, Interesting twist. "Recycled" spearhead swords seems to be common in f.i. Indonesia. I am not so familiar with Moro spearheads so I have tried to find pictures of any resembling this blade shape but couldn't. Do you have any reference pictures? Michael

10th February 2006, 11:44 PM	#5
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	michael, check the last few posts on this thread... http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001736.html maybe Kino can repost his budiak? btw, how wide is the blade???

11th February 2006, 10:29 AM	#6
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Hi Spunjer, It's 4,5 cm. Nice thread with some great spearheads, thanks. And my blade is just slightly longer than the XXL Budiak posted. I do have a Budiak so I put them next to each other. From bird perspective I agree that there are some resemblance. But looking from the side the Budiak resemblance is lost. Also my blade has both a different tip and tang than a Budiak. If you look at the blade thickness picture above it's obviously much flatter than a Budiak and thinnest at its center. Maybe Mabagani had another kind of spear in mind? Michael

11th February 2006, 05:00 PM	#7
Dajak Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 951	Hi this is not from borneo the motifs on you can find on many weapons from malay indonesia there is no influence from Borneo on this Item