Sliding weights

kronckew · 20th July 2016, 03:51 PM

this thread was linked to in another thread today about a blade with sliding balls incorporated.

as i read this thread (post 31) there appeared a rapier with a sliding section hailed as a sliding weight sword example. this is incorrect as it was actually created to solve a completely different problem.

as rapiers became fashionable, they increased in length to almost silly proportions.m some wielders went accompanied by a servant that would help them draw and re-sheath the blade as needed.

numbers of gentlemen carrying these long swords were quite a tripping hazard and cumbersome to manoeuvrer in crowds, and could actually provoke duels. laws were passed to limit blade lengths. i recall london set a maximum BLADE length of 40 inches.

guards at the city gates would actually measure blades, and if found too long the owner could be fined and/or his blade snapped off to make it fit the regs.

this sword posted earlier was a design to circumvent the law, as it's long blade was slid back to allow it to be sheathed without requiring a servant while also becoming a regulation blade length with a long grip to bypass the regs - which did not specify an overall length.

if drawn in anger, the blade was slid out and locked in place rather them sliding in and out freely.

overly long rapiers with thrusting only type blades were an affectation of society that died out fairly quickly - that's why so few examples exist. they didn't really work well in a duel, gentlemanly rules of engagement which covered the flaws thankfully were rarely carried over to military blades that stuck to a more practical carry & use length suitable for the no rules melee of hand to hand desperate combat.

Jens Nordlunde · 20th July 2016, 04:43 PM

Interesting discussions we had in the good ol' days

.

kronckew · 20th July 2016, 04:45 PM

luckily we keep on learning instead of stagnating.

Jim McDougall · 20th July 2016, 05:56 PM

Excellent Kronckew!!! Indeed, we DO keep learning, and mostly because of those here who contribute and share the remarkable knowledge they hold in their specialized fields. Also, that members like yourself revive old threads and topics like this one, bringing into them new evidence or simply new avenues of research on them.
Jens, we did have amazing discussions back in those days, and it always further amazes me at how far we have all grown because of them.

During these earlier discussions, it seems that the affectation of the 'pearls' in blade channels was included and found to have been from a Persian decorative innovation on blades. It was at some point transmitted to both Indian and Chinese cultural spheres, where they were popularized in recognized degree.

I do recall in rapier discussions several years ago the case of these 'adjustable' blades was brought up and as noted the blade length had become a 'legal' dilemma in Spain and I believe others. I believe this was also the basis for the folding knives well known as 'navaja'

It was interesting here to see discussions involving members who are sorely missed as well who have been long absent, and the depth of the discourse which brought examples, cases and empirical data to light versus some of the fascinating 'lore'.

Well done, thank you!

ariel · 21st July 2016, 02:06 AM

Good old days.....
When the water was wetter and the girls prettier....

kronckew · 21st July 2016, 09:26 AM

the trouble with water is that it is wet. if the man upstairs had wanted us to get wet he would have given us fins. i spent a few decades of my life ensuring i did not have to actually swim in the stuff by putting a large ship underneath me to separate myself from it. even our closets relatives, gorillas and chimps, cover themselves with leaves when it rains.

i haven't drunk water in years. i drink only a couple beers a year & don't touch the hard stuff. a glass of port on xmas. i do drink coffee and vast quantities of iced sweet tea with lemon or peach flavouring. OK, that all has water as an ingredient but i can ignore it. the occasional shower is unavoidable.

all women are beautiful. some more than others. i find the range of really beautiful women has expanded as i get older.

fernando · 21st July 2016, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

... as rapiers became fashionable, they increased in length to almost silly proportions.m some wielders went accompanied by a servant that would help them draw and re-sheath the blade as needed....

I am truly amazed with such resource ... a sword drawing servant; would never dream of it. Do you racall the source where you read such passage, Wayne ?

20th July 2016, 03:51 PM	#1
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,238	this thread was linked to in another thread today about a blade with sliding balls incorporated. as i read this thread (post 31) there appeared a rapier with a sliding section hailed as a sliding weight sword example. this is incorrect as it was actually created to solve a completely different problem. as rapiers became fashionable, they increased in length to almost silly proportions.m some wielders went accompanied by a servant that would help them draw and re-sheath the blade as needed. numbers of gentlemen carrying these long swords were quite a tripping hazard and cumbersome to manoeuvrer in crowds, and could actually provoke duels. laws were passed to limit blade lengths. i recall london set a maximum BLADE length of 40 inches. guards at the city gates would actually measure blades, and if found too long the owner could be fined and/or his blade snapped off to make it fit the regs. this sword posted earlier was a design to circumvent the law, as it's long blade was slid back to allow it to be sheathed without requiring a servant while also becoming a regulation blade length with a long grip to bypass the regs - which did not specify an overall length. if drawn in anger, the blade was slid out and locked in place rather them sliding in and out freely. overly long rapiers with thrusting only type blades were an affectation of society that died out fairly quickly - that's why so few examples exist. they didn't really work well in a duel, gentlemanly rules of engagement which covered the flaws thankfully were rarely carried over to military blades that stuck to a more practical carry & use length suitable for the no rules melee of hand to hand desperate combat.

20th July 2016, 04:43 PM	#2
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Interesting discussions we had in the good ol' days .

20th July 2016, 04:45 PM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,238	luckily we keep on learning instead of stagnating.

20th July 2016, 05:56 PM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,457	Excellent Kronckew!!! Indeed, we DO keep learning, and mostly because of those here who contribute and share the remarkable knowledge they hold in their specialized fields. Also, that members like yourself revive old threads and topics like this one, bringing into them new evidence or simply new avenues of research on them. Jens, we did have amazing discussions back in those days, and it always further amazes me at how far we have all grown because of them. During these earlier discussions, it seems that the affectation of the 'pearls' in blade channels was included and found to have been from a Persian decorative innovation on blades. It was at some point transmitted to both Indian and Chinese cultural spheres, where they were popularized in recognized degree. I do recall in rapier discussions several years ago the case of these 'adjustable' blades was brought up and as noted the blade length had become a 'legal' dilemma in Spain and I believe others. I believe this was also the basis for the folding knives well known as 'navaja' It was interesting here to see discussions involving members who are sorely missed as well who have been long absent, and the depth of the discourse which brought examples, cases and empirical data to light versus some of the fascinating 'lore'. Well done, thank you!

21st July 2016, 02:06 AM	#5
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Good old days..... When the water was wetter and the girls prettier....

21st July 2016, 09:26 AM	#6
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,238	the trouble with water is that it is wet. if the man upstairs had wanted us to get wet he would have given us fins. i spent a few decades of my life ensuring i did not have to actually swim in the stuff by putting a large ship underneath me to separate myself from it. even our closets relatives, gorillas and chimps, cover themselves with leaves when it rains. i haven't drunk water in years. i drink only a couple beers a year & don't touch the hard stuff. a glass of port on xmas. i do drink coffee and vast quantities of iced sweet tea with lemon or peach flavouring. OK, that all has water as an ingredient but i can ignore it. the occasional shower is unavoidable. all women are beautiful. some more than others. i find the range of really beautiful women has expanded as i get older.