A caucasian shashka from my collection for comment

ariel · 12th April 2016, 12:13 PM

Nothing in hand-made weapons is 100% standard. Just a personal feeling. The same is true about the dating.
It is an unquestionable late caucasian shashka, and way too luxurious to be made for fighting. More of an "artistic" grade.

BerberDagger · 12th April 2016, 12:43 PM

Hi At All and Thanks For comments and imput ! I think no doubts Abaut The quality Of This shashka ! I think in my only opinion it s dated near 1880 - 1910 cca ! I post Others pics Of The fittings ! The niello work Is Really incredible in This exemple !

BerberDagger · 12th April 2016, 12:44 PM

The mark

mariusgmioc · 12th April 2016, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ariel

Nothing in hand-made weapons is 100% standard. Just a personal feeling. The same is true about the dating.
It is an unquestionable late caucasian shashka, and way too luxurious to be made for fighting. More of an "artistic" grade.

Being lavishly and elaborately decorated doesn't prevent it from being an excellent fighting weapon. It might have simply been comissioned for a high ranking local leader or was intended as a present for an important person. Let's not forget that the Shashka is also part of the national attire in the Caucasus area and is considered a status symbol.

Anyhow, the workmanship of the blade appears to qualify this one as an excellent cutting blade.

But I guess it is quite important to know if the blade has a sharp cutting edge or not as, this may be quite important in establishing its purpose.

BerberDagger · 12th April 2016, 05:54 PM

I fully agree with Marius , these sabres are aways simbol of power from nobleman and hight rank people..

The blade is very flexible and have a nice pattern ... and yes is quite sharp .

regards
Lorenzo

Rumpel · 12th April 2016, 06:05 PM

A closer look at the '84' hallmark may help with pinning down the date?

http://www.925-1000.com/Frussia_kokoshnik_01.html

She appears to be looking right, so post-1908

estcrh · 12th April 2016, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rumpel

A closer look at the '84' hallmark may help with pinning down the date?

http://www.925-1000.com/Frussia_kokoshnik_01.html

She appears to be looking right, so post-1908

The internet is amazing.

estcrh · 12th April 2016, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariusgmioc

Being lavishly and elaborately decorated doesn't prevent it from being an excellent fighting weapon. It might have simply been comissioned for a high ranking local leader or was intended as a present for an important person. Let's not forget that the Shashka is also part of the national attire in the Caucasus area and is considered a status symbol.

Anyhow, the workmanship of the blade appears to qualify this one as an excellent cutting blade.

But I guess it is quite important to know if the blade has a sharp cutting edge or not as, this may be quite important in establishing its purpose.

This is an arguement that comes up from time to time. I have seen many highly decorated weapons and armor which would serve the exact same purpose as plain examples. Rich and powerful men were expected to have much more elaborate arms, I think you have to judge each example individually.

BerberDagger · 12th April 2016, 09:13 PM

estcrh , you are right ! I ve a very furnish collection of caucasian arms , much of them bought from my granfather who travelled a lot in Russia and Turkey 70 years ago and this one is not the best I see ...caucasian arms sometimes are gold decorated and very rich decorations .

This shashka is of sure not a zar sabre : ) but in any case is a quite rich exemple ,certain not of poor quality or for a normal person ( old ) owner .

thanks a lot for the marks illustration . I have this book too .

estcrh · 14th April 2016, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BerberDagger

estcrh , you are right ! I ve a very furnish collection of caucasian arms , much of them bought from my granfather who travelled a lot in Russia and Turkey 70 years ago and this one is not the best I see ...caucasian arms sometimes are gold decorated and very rich decorations .

If you have other examples hopefully we will be able to see some more. One question, when a shashka is labled as "Caucasian" is it Circassian, Russian, Cossack etc or is this a general term with no exact known origin.

mariusgmioc · 14th April 2016, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estcrh

If you have other examples hopefully we will be able to see some more. One question, when a shashka is labled as "Caucasian" is it Circassian, Russian, Cossack etc or is this a general term with no exact known origin.

I think it would be difficult to clear up this ambiguity since "Caucasian" may refer to where it came from, or it may refer to the type with the hilt partially sunk in the scabbard.

ariel · 15th April 2016, 02:18 AM

Embossed ( chased) thin silver foil is extremely fragile. Niello is easily worn off. Such lavish examples were not intended for the battlefield.
I am sure there were "rich and famous" who wore them for portraits, official functions etc. , but by and large these lavish ones were intended to spend their lives on a carpeted wall in a " man's cave".

This one is 100+ years old and completely pristine: not a scratch, no damaged silver, no loss of niello, no nicks on the edge. This is a collection-grade artistic shashka made at the age when shashkas were gasping for air.

Please note: I am not denying its age and authenticity and not denigrating its artistic value. I am just putting my 5 cents worth about its fighting "Raison d'être".

12th April 2016, 12:43 PM	#2
BerberDagger Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 247	Hi At All and Thanks For comments and imput ! I think no doubts Abaut The quality Of This shashka ! I think in my only opinion it s dated near 1880 - 1910 cca ! I post Others pics Of The fittings ! The niello work Is Really incredible in This exemple ! Attached Images

12th April 2016, 12:44 PM	#3
BerberDagger Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 247	The mark Attached Images

12th April 2016, 05:54 PM	#5
BerberDagger Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 247	reply I fully agree with Marius , these sabres are aways simbol of power from nobleman and hight rank people.. The blade is very flexible and have a nice pattern ... and yes is quite sharp . regards Lorenzo

12th April 2016, 09:13 PM	#9
BerberDagger Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 247	reply estcrh , you are right ! I ve a very furnish collection of caucasian arms , much of them bought from my granfather who travelled a lot in Russia and Turkey 70 years ago and this one is not the best I see ...caucasian arms sometimes are gold decorated and very rich decorations . This shashka is of sure not a zar sabre : ) but in any case is a quite rich exemple ,certain not of poor quality or for a normal person ( old ) owner . thanks a lot for the marks illustration . I have this book too .

12th April 2016, 12:13 PM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Nothing in hand-made weapons is 100% standard. Just a personal feeling. The same is true about the dating. It is an unquestionable late caucasian shashka, and way too luxurious to be made for fighting. More of an "artistic" grade.

12th April 2016, 06:05 PM	#6
Rumpel Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 63	A closer look at the '84' hallmark may help with pinning down the date? http://www.925-1000.com/Frussia_kokoshnik_01.html She appears to be looking right, so post-1908

15th April 2016, 02:18 AM	#12
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Embossed ( chased) thin silver foil is extremely fragile. Niello is easily worn off. Such lavish examples were not intended for the battlefield. I am sure there were "rich and famous" who wore them for portraits, official functions etc. , but by and large these lavish ones were intended to spend their lives on a carpeted wall in a " man's cave". This one is 100+ years old and completely pristine: not a scratch, no damaged silver, no loss of niello, no nicks on the edge. This is a collection-grade artistic shashka made at the age when shashkas were gasping for air. Please note: I am not denying its age and authenticity and not denigrating its artistic value. I am just putting my 5 cents worth about its fighting "Raison d'être".