Mantras keris and empu

[A. G. Maisey]

Of course.

Keris culture is based upon a number of belief systems.

All of the great belief systems, all of the great philosophies, are based upon belief systems.

Do all of the followers of those great religions and great philosophies hold exactly the same views?

[Pusaka]

I think however there are many of the older Indonesians who will not consider a keris maker an empu unless he can give life to a blade, now the method that is followed to do that might have changed. I would imagine a Muslim would use prayers whilst a Hindu would use mantras, fasting and offerings might be carried out by both. "finger tuning" well I guess there is something to that also.

[David]

Originally Posted by Pusaka

I think however there are many of the older Indonesians who will not consider a keris maker an empu unless he can give life to a blade, now the method that is followed to do that might have changed.

Pusaka, are you operating under the impression that only an empu can create a "real" keris. If so you have eliminated a great deal of antique keris from the "real keris" category.

[Pusaka]

Originally Posted by David

Pusaka, are you operating under the impression that only an empu can create a "real" keris. If so you have eliminated a great deal of antique keris from the "real keris" category.

It is impossible to look at an ancient keris and know if the person who made it was an empu or not purely based on physical appearance. The technique to enliven a blade in its details is or was within a few family's and they dont hand that information freely out. Therefor without that knowledge (precise knowledge of the mantras etc) you cannot produce a living blade. You can produce a beautifully looking blade but you cant fill it ie it is a keris mati (a dead keris).

The question is what happens if you change religion can you still practice that ritual or do you have to change it?

There are legends in various silat schools about who the first empu was and who he inherited this knowledge from.

[David]

Originally Posted by Pusaka

There are legends in various silat schools about who the first empu was and who he inherited this knowledge from.

Yes Pusaka, they say a lot of things about keris in the various silat schools.
In response to your question i can only repeat the words which Alan has already written in this thread. Islam in Indonesia is not the same as Islam anywhere else in the world. It has assimilated past practices of the people of the region and traditions both animistic and Hindu in nature continue to this day. Yes, the intent and purpose of the keris certainly changed with the influx of Islam. Perhaps mantras changed, perhaps they stayed the same. As has already been pointed out, these mantras are not for you or i to know. However, it seems highly unlikely to me that there is just one correct mantra or only one way to install "life" into a keris blade.

[Mick]

This discussion is veering into one of the "mystical" properties of beliefs in regard to the keris.

There is a small number of people who profess that they have the ability to determine if a keris has been empowered. They don't look at the workmanship of a piece, but just handle it with the most important portion being the blade.

One of these people told me that an empowered blade will give a tingling feeling to his hands while a regular blade will not. This individual visited me before I left the country about 40 years ago, went through the 20 or so of the kerises that I had on hand and picked out about three or four as having power. I, obviously, don't profess to have this ability, so I didn't feel any difference between these kerises and the rest of the bunch. But this is one of the things that arise when you really study the subject of kerises.

There was a great deal of keris information that was never discussed by the local population as this material was "almost" considered sacred. In addition to this fact, the few real experts on this topic "even if you knew them and were friends" would guard their information fiercely. Trying to obtain information from them was like pulling their teeth. Unfortunately, these few people have since died and, because of this "in western opinion" character flaw their valuable information died with them.

[A. G. Maisey]

Thank you for your post Mick.

Your experience in the home of keris culture was at a time when the nature of the culture was changing forever. Probably the very last people in Jawa whose keris knowledge and experience spanned the period from pre-WWII through into the modern age left us during the 1990's.

Because there was a general perception amongst these people that the younger generations had lost their way, I believe most of them did not accept pupils or followers and so much of the knowledge, experience, belief of the older generations is now lost indeed.

At the present time I fear that history is repeating itself:- those people who truly do have some of the deeper keris knowledge are extremely reluctant to accept pupils or followers because they are unable to find people with both the interest in keris and the mind-set to permit those people to learn the deeper aspects of keris belief.

Perhaps all the knowledge and belief of previous generations is not yet lost, but I feel that it soon will be.

Hidden knowledge is not passed freely to everybody:- that is why we know it as hidden knowledge. Exactly the same thing applies with the hidden knowledge of any religion. The masses are permitted a limited understanding, only the initiates have the hidden doors opened for them. As the difficulty of comprehending the hidden knowledge increases, fewer and fewer people have access to that knowledge.

In the World of the Keris, the only way to have a door opened for you is to be accepted by somebody who holds the knowledge and who is prepared to teach you, and that person will never pass knowledge to you gratuitously, but only in response to the questions you ask, because those questions will indicate to the Teacher the existing knowledge and mindset of his pupil.

[Pusaka]

Originally Posted by Mick

This discussion is veering into one of the "mystical" properties of beliefs in regard to the keris.

It started as a thread about the mystical properties ie mantra. That is a major aspect in keris too.

Originally Posted by Mick

One of these people told me that an empowered blade will give a tingling feeling to his hands while a regular blade will not. This individual visited me before I left the country about 40 years ago, went through the 20 or so of the kerises that I had on hand and picked out about three or four as having power. I, obviously, don't profess to have this ability, so I didn't feel any difference between these kerises and the rest of the bunch. But this is one of the things that arise when you really study the subject of kerises.

One guru I knew believed the same, he would hold a keris blade between his thumb and index finger and feel for a vibration.

People would bring him keris occasionally but the thing is he was secretive and if someone had a live blade he would not tell them. I remember actually one occasion in which after the person had gone I overheard him say to one of his senior students "that blade was live, but I went going to tell him that"

[Pusaka]

Originally Posted by David

Yes Pusaka, they say a lot of things about keris in the various silat schools.

Silat is as old as the keris itself, therefore there are teachings regarding it that old too held by gurus.

[David]

Originally Posted by Pusaka

Silat is as old as the keris itself, therefore there are teachings regarding it that old too held by gurus.

Some form of silat has indeed been around for centuries, passed by oral tradition. Silat, however, has changed greatly over the years, even more so as it has moved away from its origins in the Indonesian/Malay area to schools around the world. It is fairly well acknowledged though that the keris has become a central weapon in many of it's various schools only relatively recently, probably due to the recognition of its cultural importance in the area. But i seriously do not want this to become a discussion or debate on silat and it variant forms. This is not a silat forum. The keris stands alone from this martial art and it certainly wasn't created to serve it.
Much of what is "true" of anything in this world is a matter of our perception. There are those who believe that a keris blade can either be "dead" or "alive" and there are those who feel that all keris are merely artist weapons and artifacts. There are those who claim they can feel and perceive the difference. Sometimes these astute and highly trained individuals will disagree on such matters. I have even heard tell of the same person giving different opinions on the same keris on different days. Does that make that person a charlatan. Not necessarily. It depends upon what you believe. But debating these subjects seems pointless to me. I personally know when i am holding a keris that is particularly powerful to me. Yes, i can feel it, can't you? Maybe you just don't believe hard enough. You see, belief can be a powerful thing in and of itself.
I would disagree with Pusaka in that i believe all of us are indeed born with the ability to feel vibrations. These innate abilities are drowned out by the day to day rigors of mundane living. Training techniques only open up this ability to perceive. And there are many exercises to help us achieve this aside from "rasa" if we wish to pursue them. However, most this kind of perception is unnecessary for our appreciation of the keris. We all understand that the keris has over the centuries fulfilled a multitude of cultural purposes and that some of those purposes have changed over time within that changing culture. As Alan so correctly put it "It is not the place of anybody who is not a part of the owning culture to dictate to people within that culture what is appropriate for the culture." And it must be understood that aside from what has most certainly been lost over time that keris culture is a indeed living and probably still changing culture. I believe it would be a great mistake to dismiss keris that someone claiming mystical powers says to be "mati" as not being a "real" keris simply because of that assigned designation, especially when we consider just how subjective such observations can be.