Blunderbuss for comments

fernando · 22nd July 2015, 03:00 PM

Thank you all for your comments, Gentlemen.
Fernando, the brass section on the barrel mouth is only a sheet applied to the steel and, surprisingly, not fully around, but only covering the visual part of it; definitely a decoration purpose.
I see your point that the hook would be for a sling (talabarte) due to this gun's weight, although its shape is precisely that of a waist belt hook (gancho de cinturon).
You are right in that the ramrod (baqueta) is not the correct one; it is going to be a problem to get a wooden one with a brass or bone tip, but i will give it a try.

Marcus, i agree with buck shot being basicaly the ammunition for these things; even some times all kinds of junk pieces, as per circumstances. When i mentioned 'caliber' was only to give an idea of the bore diameter.

Thank you Mark for the naval approach

. It is possible, yes; but we can't discard the stage coach or armed guard possibilities, this one based on the waist/shoulder hook presence.

.

Shakethetrees · 22nd July 2015, 04:51 PM

Great piece! It would fit well into my collection!

If you look more closely at the last photo of the muzzle, you'll see that the iron barrel shows itself at the muzzle by a rough ring maybe one or two mm thick. The reason it appears that the brass bell only covers the exposed part of the barrel is that the entire flat of the muzzle has darkened and corroded with age. Only the exposed edge has had handling wear or polishing that exposes what appears to be a partial wrap.

This is a fairly unique bit of embellishment that I might have seen only once or twice before, although in not very familiar with Portuguese guns.

But, to restate it, the rusted bore and muzzle shows by reason of its different texture than the darkened brass bell.

Great piece!

fernando · 22nd July 2015, 06:08 PM

How dumb i was; you are right

.
I first thought that the 2 m/m 'porous layer' of the muzzle was another quality of steel, or 'burnt' by fire use; did not realize that it was the only part not covered by the all round brass wrapping, indeed a subtle job.
Looking now at it, one may discern that thin pelicule of metal, even in the more oxided lower area of the muzzle.

.

fernando · 28th July 2015, 06:49 PM

So far so good.
After half hour trying to unscrew the lock, applying extreme force with a cross handle screw driver, a local fellow collector managed to pull it out. Another hour to treat the interior with penetrating oil and fortunately all parts functioning again. It was all about never been touched for long, long time; rust and dirt. Actualy all parts are in a fair good condition.
What apparently has no solution is the spring that has no tension against the frizzen's toe; we stuck in its interior some wood spacer to spread it a bit, in order to gain back some tension ... only to prevent the frizzen from tumbling loose.
Now the local (competent) stock maker is going to reconstruct the 'splinter' that is missing in the forend.
Will show pictures of both details when i pick ut up from the stock maker.
And, last but not least, i have strong hopes to get a propper ramrod from someone who cared to answer my appeal.

Kmaddock · 28th July 2015, 07:44 PM

Hi Fernando
If you have any metal working friends you could re anneal the spring
First heat red hot and let cool slowly in very warm sand over period of few hours, I warm the sand in the oven and then put spring into the tray of sand back into oven and let it all cool down slowly, strictly a job when wives are out of the house.
It will now be soft and you will be able to bend it to desired stretch
Then heat it red hot and quench it in cold water to harden it, it now will be v hard and brittle
Next you heat to a blue colour and quench in oil, whale oil is recommended but I use engine oil
You will find this works perfectly and there is a great satisfaction in getting these old guns back operational
Lovely gun by the way congratulations on a fine acquisition
Regards
Ken

Shakethetrees · 29th July 2015, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kmaddock

Hi Fernando
If you have any metal working friends you could re anneal the spring
First heat red hot and let cool slowly in very warm sand over period of few hours, I warm the sand in the oven and then put spring into the tray of sand back into oven and let it all cool down slowly, strictly a job when wives are out of the house.
It will now be soft and you will be able to bend it to desired stretch
Then heat it red hot and quench it in cold water to harden it, it now will be v hard and brittle
Next you heat to a blue colour and quench in oil, whale oil is recommended but I use engine oil
You will find this works perfectly and there is a great satisfaction in getting these old guns back operational
Lovely gun by the way congratulations on a fine acquisition
Regards
Ken

Please check it over well inside and out with a magnifying glass before you do any heat treating or bending!

I did this a while back and found out the hard way when it suddenly broke, turning it into a pattern for a new hand made spring!

Ken Maddock · 29th July 2015, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shakethetrees

Please check it over well inside and out with a magnifying glass before you do any heat treating or bending!

I did this a while back and found out the hard way when it suddenly broke, turning it into a pattern for a new hand made spring!

Hi
I assume you were looking for cracks, maybe a tread on home gun smithing tips and repair advice would be worth while.
I have a great method for removing stuck screws which I am going to employ tonight, I will photograph and show method and hopefully a positive result
regards
Ken

22nd July 2015, 03:00 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Thank you all for your comments, Gentlemen. Fernando, the brass section on the barrel mouth is only a sheet applied to the steel and, surprisingly, not fully around, but only covering the visual part of it; definitely a decoration purpose. I see your point that the hook would be for a sling (talabarte) due to this gun's weight, although its shape is precisely that of a waist belt hook (gancho de cinturon). You are right in that the ramrod (baqueta) is not the correct one; it is going to be a problem to get a wooden one with a brass or bone tip, but i will give it a try. Marcus, i agree with buck shot being basicaly the ammunition for these things; even some times all kinds of junk pieces, as per circumstances. When i mentioned 'caliber' was only to give an idea of the bore diameter. Thank you Mark for the naval approach . It is possible, yes; but we can't discard the stage coach or armed guard possibilities, this one based on the waist/shoulder hook presence. . Attached Images Last edited by fernando; 22nd July 2015 at 07:52 PM.

22nd July 2015, 06:08 PM	#3
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	How dumb i was; you are right . I first thought that the 2 m/m 'porous layer' of the muzzle was another quality of steel, or 'burnt' by fire use; did not realize that it was the only part not covered by the all round brass wrapping, indeed a subtle job. Looking now at it, one may discern that thin pelicule of metal, even in the more oxided lower area of the muzzle. . Attached Images

22nd July 2015, 04:51 PM	#2
Shakethetrees Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Louisiana Posts: 363	Great piece! It would fit well into my collection! If you look more closely at the last photo of the muzzle, you'll see that the iron barrel shows itself at the muzzle by a rough ring maybe one or two mm thick. The reason it appears that the brass bell only covers the exposed part of the barrel is that the entire flat of the muzzle has darkened and corroded with age. Only the exposed edge has had handling wear or polishing that exposes what appears to be a partial wrap. This is a fairly unique bit of embellishment that I might have seen only once or twice before, although in not very familiar with Portuguese guns. But, to restate it, the rusted bore and muzzle shows by reason of its different texture than the darkened brass bell. Great piece!

28th July 2015, 06:49 PM	#4
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	So far so good. After half hour trying to unscrew the lock, applying extreme force with a cross handle screw driver, a local fellow collector managed to pull it out. Another hour to treat the interior with penetrating oil and fortunately all parts functioning again. It was all about never been touched for long, long time; rust and dirt. Actualy all parts are in a fair good condition. What apparently has no solution is the spring that has no tension against the frizzen's toe; we stuck in its interior some wood spacer to spread it a bit, in order to gain back some tension ... only to prevent the frizzen from tumbling loose. Now the local (competent) stock maker is going to reconstruct the 'splinter' that is missing in the forend. Will show pictures of both details when i pick ut up from the stock maker. And, last but not least, i have strong hopes to get a propper ramrod from someone who cared to answer my appeal.

28th July 2015, 07:44 PM	#5
Kmaddock Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Ireland Posts: 543	Hi Fernando If you have any metal working friends you could re anneal the spring First heat red hot and let cool slowly in very warm sand over period of few hours, I warm the sand in the oven and then put spring into the tray of sand back into oven and let it all cool down slowly, strictly a job when wives are out of the house. It will now be soft and you will be able to bend it to desired stretch Then heat it red hot and quench it in cold water to harden it, it now will be v hard and brittle Next you heat to a blue colour and quench in oil, whale oil is recommended but I use engine oil You will find this works perfectly and there is a great satisfaction in getting these old guns back operational Lovely gun by the way congratulations on a fine acquisition Regards Ken