Pala Kilic Wootz? with European Hilt.

Kubur · 14th July 2015, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sancar

Indeed!

Hi Spiral & Sancar,
I'm still looking for a descent one, for a descent price...
Hard to find

Kubur

Jim McDougall · 14th July 2015, 05:12 PM

Well done Kubur!!! Thank you for reviving this fascinating item and thread, and especially for the outstanding follow up.
I am very much in accord with your suggestion this is quite likely an Austrian 'tribute' type weapon. It seems that the tradition of 'oriental' styles with Eastern European countries swords is of course long standing, and we see the Ottoman style hilts on many of their sabres, the Polish versions of karabela notwithstanding.

I think it would be worth recalling the many auxiliary units in the Austrian and other armies such as the Freikorps, which evolved out of the famed 'Pandour' regiments of Maria Theresa's forces in the mid 18th c.
These units became popular in the Austrian and other European armies some time after the disbanding of von Trencks units in 1750s.
The weaponry and fashions of these units was quite 'exotic' and favored of course many Ottoman forms and styles. It would seem these lavishly decorated sabres posted here might fall into such category.

If I am not mistaken, in Solingen I believe, there were some efforts in producing 'watered steel' blades in the manner of wootz, but I have so little knowledge of details I cannot go further. I am wondering however, if this situation could account for such blades in these interpretative ( and magnificent!) examples.

In the last images, the blade with notching in the blade back reminds me of the curious notches in blades on Scottish skean dhub knives, I think it is termed 'jimpul' . Not suggesting any connection but thought an interesting note.

spiral · 15th July 2015, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Hi Spiral & Sancar,
I'm still looking for a descent one, for a descent price...
Hard to find

Kubur

Indeed, I think Normans got the best one....

Spiral

14th July 2015, 05:12 PM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,189	Well done Kubur!!! Thank you for reviving this fascinating item and thread, and especially for the outstanding follow up. I am very much in accord with your suggestion this is quite likely an Austrian 'tribute' type weapon. It seems that the tradition of 'oriental' styles with Eastern European countries swords is of course long standing, and we see the Ottoman style hilts on many of their sabres, the Polish versions of karabela notwithstanding. I think it would be worth recalling the many auxiliary units in the Austrian and other armies such as the Freikorps, which evolved out of the famed 'Pandour' regiments of Maria Theresa's forces in the mid 18th c. These units became popular in the Austrian and other European armies some time after the disbanding of von Trencks units in 1750s. The weaponry and fashions of these units was quite 'exotic' and favored of course many Ottoman forms and styles. It would seem these lavishly decorated sabres posted here might fall into such category. If I am not mistaken, in Solingen I believe, there were some efforts in producing 'watered steel' blades in the manner of wootz, but I have so little knowledge of details I cannot go further. I am wondering however, if this situation could account for such blades in these interpretative ( and magnificent!) examples. In the last images, the blade with notching in the blade back reminds me of the curious notches in blades on Scottish skean dhub knives, I think it is termed 'jimpul' . Not suggesting any connection but thought an interesting note.