Restoration suggestion

Sid · 8th September 2014, 12:05 PM

Dear All,

Greeting from a new member

.

I bought some Keris couple years ago.
2 or 3 of them need a restoration, IMHO the blade, hilt and scabbard are not matched each other. It would be wiser if i ask opinion from anyone in this forum that have deeper knowledge about keris and its peripherals (before I start to restore it).
Please give me some suggestion about:
1. What is the best type and style of wood for Hilt & Scabbard?
2. Do I need change the mendak or pendok?
3. Etc.

Any comment would be appreciated.
Thank very much you for your help

.

David · 8th September 2014, 08:45 PM

Welcome to the keris forum Sid!
I'm not sure i see need for "restoration" here, but this certainly seems to be a bit of a mix bag.
Firstly, that is a fabulous ivory donoriko style hilt from Madura. From your photos i am not convinced that your blade is not also from Madura, though it could be Javanese, which would make it correct for the sheath. But there is something that doesn't look quite right for a Javanese blade in the profile and it looks like the gandik area slants inward towards the blade which could indicate a Madura origin. However the sheath is clearly a formal style (ladrang) Surakarta style from Jawa, so you are right that it does not match the hilt. I see nothing wrong with the open style pendok on the stem that would require replacement. Perhaps you could try to polish it up a bit. That hilt cup is not a mendak btw and is indeed incorrect for this style of hilt and sheath.
The blade is a nice one. Can't see any rust and i wouldn't bother restraining from the looks of its current condition, but it does look like it could use a good oiling.
It seems a shame to swap out such a beautiful hilt, but more correct for the sheath form would be a simple planar style hilt like the one below. I would also look for a new mendak. You can often find these parts reasonably priced on eBay.
Styles change, but i would suggest you find a hilt in a wood either equal to or darker than the wood of the sheath (wrongko).
Though the hilt is in the wrong orientation in this photo (it should face directly over the front end of the sheath, this is a fine example of what would work best with this sheath form.

David · 8th September 2014, 08:48 PM

Of course, if this is indeed a Madura blade then you might want to change the sheath and keep the hilt in place, though this is a more difficult and expensive proposition. But the hilt cup needs to go either way…

Sajen · 8th September 2014, 09:18 PM

Agree with all statements David has made but want to add that I would like to see the blade in classic view, by this pictures I have problems to say something about the blade.

The donoriko hilt is indeed very nice but the ladrang sheath seems to be also from better quality.
Maybe you can post some pictures like you can see maybe in the given threads?
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8390
or here post #13: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=13282

Regards,
Detlef

David · 8th September 2014, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

Agree with all statements David has made but want to add that I would like to see the blade in classic view, by this pictures I have problems to say something about the blade.

The donoriko hilt is indeed very nice but the ladrang sheath seems to be also from better quality.
Maybe you can post some pictures like you can see maybe in the given threads?
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8390
or here post #13: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=13282

Regards,
Detlef

I completely agree with Detlef on this which is why i stated that "from your pictures" i was uncertain. Photographs are always a difficult way to assess any keris, but proper orientation of the blade in your photographs will help the process.
If you choose to change the hilt be sure that you find a Surakarta planar hilt as opposed to a Yogyakarta one. The clearest difference other than Surakarta hilts generally being larger is the "top knot" that appears over the top cecekan (stylized face carving). This thread might be helpful to you.
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?p=119946

A. G. Maisey · 8th September 2014, 11:42 PM

Sid, you have asked:-

What is the best type and style of wood for Hilt & Scabbard?

The simple answer to this question is that there is no "best wood".

Your existing scabbard (wrongko, wrangka, warangka) is a Javanese formal (ladrangan) scabbard, and as has already been advised looks to be totally acceptable with this blade.

There is a heirarchy for the materials used for a scabbard in Jawa, but this heirarchy depends more strongly upon the purpose of the scabbard in a social context, rather than upon any perception of "best".

Notwithstanding this social orientation there are several woods that the Javanese people place a high value upon for a keris scabbard, perhaps the most highly prized would be scented sandalwood (cendono,cendana) with a burl grain (gembol) or a feather crotch grain (simbar). Both of these wood types are not freely available and you could wait a lifetime before being given the opportunity to purchase a piece sufficient for a scabbard --- at an astoundingly high price.

Similarly with hilt (ukiran, jejeran) woods. There are many suitable woods but perhaps the most highly prized is tayuman. This is a very dense wood that sinks in water. It is not suitable for wear in daylight because it is very subject to cracking under direct sunlight. Apart from wood, many other materials are also used for the hilt, and again use depends upon social purpose or hierarchy.

Regarding the keris you have shown us. I endorse the remarks of David and Detlef and suggest that this seemingly very fine hilt be removed from this keris and kept as a stand alone display item.

Rick · 8th September 2014, 11:50 PM

Would love to see a series of pics of just the hilt, please .

David · 9th September 2014, 01:58 AM

Yes, the hilt is deeply and skillfully carved and has some motifs which, at least to my experience, aren't that common in this form. I would love to see some nice, sharp close-ups of it. I agree with Alan, keep it as a stand alone item, at least until the appropriate keris presents itself.

Sid · 9th September 2014, 12:27 PM

Hi

David, Sajen, Alan and Rick, thank you for your opinions.
I try summarize it below:
1. Change the mendak (must be).
2. Keep the warangka & Pendok (need to be clean & re polish

).
3. Change the hilt with surakarta planar with much darker color wood , I prefer Kayu tayuman or arang and keep donoriko style hilt (stand alone).

I will post pics of the hilt closely and the final result of the keris make over as soon as i get back to Indonesia (probably on Dec).

would you mind to give your opinion on my others keris please ?
its 4 of them not 2 or 3 as mentioned it before....my mistake sorry.

8th September 2014, 08:45 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,125	Welcome to the keris forum Sid! I'm not sure i see need for "restoration" here, but this certainly seems to be a bit of a mix bag. Firstly, that is a fabulous ivory donoriko style hilt from Madura. From your photos i am not convinced that your blade is not also from Madura, though it could be Javanese, which would make it correct for the sheath. But there is something that doesn't look quite right for a Javanese blade in the profile and it looks like the gandik area slants inward towards the blade which could indicate a Madura origin. However the sheath is clearly a formal style (ladrang) Surakarta style from Jawa, so you are right that it does not match the hilt. I see nothing wrong with the open style pendok on the stem that would require replacement. Perhaps you could try to polish it up a bit. That hilt cup is not a mendak btw and is indeed incorrect for this style of hilt and sheath. The blade is a nice one. Can't see any rust and i wouldn't bother restraining from the looks of its current condition, but it does look like it could use a good oiling. It seems a shame to swap out such a beautiful hilt, but more correct for the sheath form would be a simple planar style hilt like the one below. I would also look for a new mendak. You can often find these parts reasonably priced on eBay. Styles change, but i would suggest you find a hilt in a wood either equal to or darker than the wood of the sheath (wrongko). Though the hilt is in the wrong orientation in this photo (it should face directly over the front end of the sheath, this is a fine example of what would work best with this sheath form. Attached Images

9th September 2014, 12:27 PM	#9
Sid Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 6	Hi David, Sajen, Alan and Rick, thank you for your opinions. I try summarize it below: 1. Change the mendak (must be). 2. Keep the warangka & Pendok (need to be clean & re polish ). 3. Change the hilt with surakarta planar with much darker color wood , I prefer Kayu tayuman or arang and keep donoriko style hilt (stand alone). I will post pics of the hilt closely and the final result of the keris make over as soon as i get back to Indonesia (probably on Dec). would you mind to give your opinion on my others keris please ? its 4 of them not 2 or 3 as mentioned it before....my mistake sorry. Attached Images

8th September 2014, 12:05 PM	#1
Sid Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 6	Restoration suggestion Dear All, Greeting from a new member . I bought some Keris couple years ago. 2 or 3 of them need a restoration, IMHO the blade, hilt and scabbard are not matched each other. It would be wiser if i ask opinion from anyone in this forum that have deeper knowledge about keris and its peripherals (before I start to restore it). Please give me some suggestion about: 1. What is the best type and style of wood for Hilt & Scabbard? 2. Do I need change the mendak or pendok? 3. Etc. Any comment would be appreciated. Thank very much you for your help . Attached Images

8th September 2014, 08:48 PM	#3
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,125	Of course, if this is indeed a Madura blade then you might want to change the sheath and keep the hilt in place, though this is a more difficult and expensive proposition. But the hilt cup needs to go either way…

8th September 2014, 09:18 PM	#4
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,781	Agree with all statements David has made but want to add that I would like to see the blade in classic view, by this pictures I have problems to say something about the blade. The donoriko hilt is indeed very nice but the ladrang sheath seems to be also from better quality. Maybe you can post some pictures like you can see maybe in the given threads? http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8390 or here post #13: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=13282 Regards, Detlef

8th September 2014, 11:42 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,893	Sid, you have asked:- What is the best type and style of wood for Hilt & Scabbard? The simple answer to this question is that there is no "best wood". Your existing scabbard (wrongko, wrangka, warangka) is a Javanese formal (ladrangan) scabbard, and as has already been advised looks to be totally acceptable with this blade. There is a heirarchy for the materials used for a scabbard in Jawa, but this heirarchy depends more strongly upon the purpose of the scabbard in a social context, rather than upon any perception of "best". Notwithstanding this social orientation there are several woods that the Javanese people place a high value upon for a keris scabbard, perhaps the most highly prized would be scented sandalwood (cendono,cendana) with a burl grain (gembol) or a feather crotch grain (simbar). Both of these wood types are not freely available and you could wait a lifetime before being given the opportunity to purchase a piece sufficient for a scabbard --- at an astoundingly high price. Similarly with hilt (ukiran, jejeran) woods. There are many suitable woods but perhaps the most highly prized is tayuman. This is a very dense wood that sinks in water. It is not suitable for wear in daylight because it is very subject to cracking under direct sunlight. Apart from wood, many other materials are also used for the hilt, and again use depends upon social purpose or hierarchy. Regarding the keris you have shown us. I endorse the remarks of David and Detlef and suggest that this seemingly very fine hilt be removed from this keris and kept as a stand alone display item.

8th September 2014, 11:50 PM	#7
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Would love to see a series of pics of just the hilt, please .

9th September 2014, 01:58 AM	#8
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,125	Yes, the hilt is deeply and skillfully carved and has some motifs which, at least to my experience, aren't that common in this form. I would love to see some nice, sharp close-ups of it. I agree with Alan, keep it as a stand alone item, at least until the appropriate keris presents itself.