Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > European Armoury
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 30th July 2014, 06:04 PM   #1
fernando
(deceased)
 
fernando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
Posts: 9,694
Default

Not a cannon breech but one of these multiuse 'noise makers'; in this case to go bang during religious festivities, judging by the cross. No ammunition needed, just gunpowder and a wad. It is used upright.
I wouldn't think that it is spiked to avoid its functionality but to have a new life ... like for melting lead, as per your words.
The one (among several) that i have with a cross was bought in a French site.
They can be very old. Difficult to precise; maybe someone with more knowledge.
fernando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2014, 12:42 PM   #2
Matchlock
(deceased)
 
Matchlock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
Default

Hi Shakethetrees,


Don't let yourself get troubled.

Congratulations on the acquisition of what is doubtlessly a fine and very rare detached brass/bronze breech piece (chamber) from a breechloading wall gun, with its barrel mounted on a tripod or a wheeled carriage (German: Bockbüchse or Doppelhaken auf Bocklafette), and dating from the era of the Emperor Maximilian I, ca. 1500-10.

The barrel, originally cast together with a number of such interchangeable breech pieces, thus allowing rapid firing, was most certainly wrought at a Nuremberg or Tyrolean bronze foundry workshop which also specialized in church bells.

As a religious symbol, the cross on your detached breech piecewas cast in high relief integrally, and contoured by chiseling afterwards; the punched decoration of circles is characteristic of many wrought iron barrels and other items of ironworks or wood all made between ca. 1490 and 1530.

Following the three reworked images, I attached photos of a heavy wrought iron barrel of ca. 1480/90. Its top flat, too, shows the Late Gothic/Early Renaissance standard ornament of
punched circles. On my barrel, three of these circles are struck in line.
Actually, 3 has always been the most important of basic magic cyphers, in all cultures and from the earliest times. Its most common representation in Western European art history is the
Late Gothic/early Renaissance trefoil (German: Dreipass).

As I stated formerly, the trefoil ornament originally
derived from the shape of a bunch of grapes, being its most simplified and stylized representation, and contemporarily used by artisans of all arts and crafts alike - except when it came to illuminated manuscripts and illustrations in printed books. These arts, as well as paintings, engravings and woodcuts, to name just a few, usually depicted the real grapes, mostly within a running grapevine pattern.

As that





The Michael Trömner Collection


which I posted here earlier:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t+iron+barrels

The general stout mug-like shape of this breech piece, as well as its rear (German: Bodenstück) and forward (German: Mündungskopf) bulged reinforcing sections, all account for a close and early dating of ca. 1st decade 16th century.

Please cf.
the dating criteria defined and set up for the first time ever by me:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...dating+barrels

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t+iron+barrels

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...t+iron+barrels


What is most remarkable about your item is the fact that the touch hole got spiked
at some later date, with a wrought iron nail.
That simple way of rendering a cannon uselesss within seconds was a practice commonly applied in war - after the line of cannon
got overrun by the enemy's cavalry of infantry.

Spiking (German: das Zündloch (einer Kanone) vernageln) was also often employed as a means of repair to close a burned-out touch hole that allowed too much gass loss. The spiking done, a new and smaller touch hole could be either right struck while the nail red hot, or drilled.

In the case of your breech chamber, it seems that the gun it belonged to saw secondary use which as quite different from its original purpose: to receive, hold and eventually blow out a load of black powder, and a wooden muzzle plug, all of which would finally expel the ball ...

Attached find your photoshopped images, as well as some watercolors from the inventory books of the Maximilian arsenals, ca. 1502-1507, depicting brass/bronze barreled wall guns mounted on carriages, and served by two men each (German: Richt- und Feuerschütze).
One of them would aim the piece, and signal his companion when to ignite the priming powder on the pan with a red hot igniting iron (German: Loseisen); the latter had to be kept ready resting in a pot of charcoal all the time (German: Kohlebecken). Alternatively, a length of matchcord was used, consisting of twisted hemp (German: Luntenstrick) and clamped between the jaws of a forked stick.



Best,
Michael

Michael Trömner
Rebenstr. 9
D-93326 Abensberg
Bavaria, Germany
Self-established Academic Medievalist
Graduated from Regensburg University in 1982
Stipendiary recipient and Member of the Studienstiftung des deutschen Volkes, Bonn
Author of BEHÄLTNISSE FÜR KOSTBARES 1500-1700, 2005
Member of vikingsword.com, with more than 4.100 threads and posts since 2008
M. of the Arms & Armour Society, London since 1991
M. of the Gesellschaft für Historische Waffen- und Kostümkunde e.V., Berlin since 1987
Special expertises in European weapons, ironworks and furniture of the 14th through the 17th centuries

Preservation and scientific documentation of museum collections
Attached Images
            

Last edited by Matchlock; 1st August 2014 at 12:23 PM.
Matchlock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2014, 03:47 PM   #3
Matchlock
(deceased)
 
Matchlock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking
Posts: 4,310
Default


Attached below are photos of the spiked touch holes on the barrels of two guns in my collection.
Both have been illustrated in the attachments to my previous post.

The first one is my singular and highly important Nuremberg cast brass/bronze barreled wall gun (German: doppelter Doppelhaken) of ca. 1515-20.
Of course, that impressive monster cannot be termed an infantry long gun; with its overall length of 2,08 m and a weight of 35 kilos, it actually was a lighter piece of ordnance.

You can clearly see the rusty head of a wrought iron nail the original touch hole was spiked with, and a new and smaller touch hole obviously pierced with a few hammer blows.
Of course, this item was not a portable infantry long arm but a piece of lighter ordnance, and mounted on a tripod or a wheeled carriage, just like the ones depicted in the early 16th c. watercolors attached to the previous post.

For more profound information on this monstrous piece, please refer to my thread:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...nuremberg+wall



The other is the Nuremberg founded brass/bronze barrel mounted on the carriage of my lovely little GIECH cannon of ca. 1520-30 (German: Schlänglein or Tarrasbüchse).
This barrel is notable because it is not only finley made and chiseled, but is especially characteristic of arsenal arms in general, for showing the results of various stages of its apparantly very long working life.

Originally, the barrel was the essential part of a haquebut of ca. 1470, and mounted on the present carriage some 50 years later at the arsenal (German: Rüstkammer) of the Counts von Giech, on Schloss Giech in Thurnau near Bayreuth, Upper Franconia, during the Peasants Wars.

Actually, that cannon saw service and re-use over several periods of time, and at least until the mid-17th century, which means the latter years of the Thirty Years War.

Please see my thread:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...+Schl%E4nglein


Most remarkable are its featuring two! spiked touch holes.
The original first touch hole was drilled on the top flat of the barrel, with a small v-shaped trough chiseled out of the brass surface; later, and obviously burned out from heavy use, it got spiked.
On the right hand side flat,
another touch hole was pierced, and finally spiked for good- just like on our breeech in discussion.
A piece of wood underneath seems to have been broken off both crudely and deliberately, in order to attach an iron pan. Later-on, that pan obviously got removed, and the cannon was ignited once again through the first touch hole located on top of the barrel!
A typical arsenal piece story and history ...


Both these items preserved in
The Michael Trömner Collection.

All photos copyrighted by the author.
Attached Images
            

Last edited by Matchlock; 31st July 2014 at 10:52 PM.
Matchlock is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.