Kris hilt problems, solution anybody?

[A. G. Maisey]

There are a few fixes for hole bigger than tang.

Where the tang is very thin, you can make a miniature cone out of thin steel, a piece of old tin can is the sort of material to use. Fit it to the tang and hold it in place with damar or jabung, or even epoxy resin.

If the problem is a far too big hole in the tang, just plug the hole with a dowel, glue in place, and redrill.

I prefer knitting wool as the material to use for a friction fit of tang to hilt, because it compresses. Fabric and the various twines do not compress to the same degree as wool. It is pretty easy to split a hilt if you force it on.

[Battara]

That would be my concern, Alan, splitting the hulu. Thus I went with David's strategy when I worked on my Balinese ivory hulu. However never thought of what Alan said and I call him an expert. Both have merit.

Just make sure you don't split the hulu and don't use adhesive. Finally, please post your results if you would.........

[S.Workman]

I will most certainly post pictures if I can manage it. I also intend to re-do the job I did finishing another keris, so tomorrow should be a two off weather permitting.

[A. G. Maisey]

With a hilt that looks like it might split, or already has a split---and a lot of old hilts do have splits that remain unseen until the hilt is fitted--- its a good idea to only wind sufficient wool for a friction fit on the top quarter of the tang, reduce the amount of wool on the lower section of the tang to just sufficient to stop it wobbling around.

[S.Workman]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

With a hilt that looks like it might split, or already has a split---and a lot of old hilts do have splits that remain unseen until the hilt is fitted--- its a good idea to only wind sufficient wool for a friction fit on the top quarter of the tang, reduce the amount of wool on the lower section of the tang to just sufficient to stop it wobbling around.

You know a fellow is an old hand when they can tell you the proper ratio for tang winding without damage. Thank you sir.

[S.Workman]

Originally Posted by S.Workman

I will most certainly post pictures if I can manage it. I also intend to re-do the job I did finishing another keris, so tomorrow should be a two off weather permitting.

I am quoting myself to report failure on this pair of keris. One of them I now have serious doubts about needing a wash with arsenic, I think it needs to be acid washed and etched. There is no trace of pamor at all. The other one needed the arsenic wash to bring up the pamor, but it came out even worse than the first time. I think the problem is that I used bottled lime juice - it was not from concentrate, its the real thing, but I don't think the acid was concentrated enough to put the arsenic into solution. I would experiment more, but it will have to wait.

[David]

Originally Posted by S.Workman

I am quoting myself to report failure on this pair of keris. One of them I now have serious doubts about needing a wash with arsenic, I think it needs to be acid washed and etched. There is no trace of pamor at all. The other one needed the arsenic wash to bring up the pamor, but it came out even worse than the first time. I think the problem is that I used bottled lime juice - it was not from concentrate, its the real thing, but I don't think the acid was concentrated enough to put the arsenic into solution. I would experiment more, but it will have to wait.

Using warangan is a delicate and tricky process sometimes requiring multiple tries to get satisfactory results. Perhaps you can tell us more about your process. I am not sure if you are following directions you found on this site or somewhere else, but it is important that your blade has been completely cleaned of all previous warangan first, brought down to what people call a "white" blade through soaking in a mild acidic bath and scrubbing the blade clean. I have used pineapple juice in the past. I would indeed recommend fresh limes and laboratory quality arsenic (As2 O3). Weather is also an important factor. The process doesn't work well in cold and i like to work outdoors in open shade on a bright sunny day, but Alan might have some better advice for you on this as he has far more experience with the process than i do.

[A. G. Maisey]

In my experience, nothing but freshly squeezed tahitian limes will provide the fluid that you need.

In Jawa they are not called Tahitian limes, but that's what they are sold as in Oz. In my previous house I had my own tree and harvested and prepared the juice when the limes came on, then I saved the juice in the deep freeze immediately, this worked OK too.

You need to squeeze the limes, then strain the juice, then filter through clean cloth, I use an old, worn linen handerchief.

As David has said, keris staining is a very delicate process, and not real easy to get a decent result. As with any skill, it takes time to learn.

[S.Workman]

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

In my experience, nothing but freshly squeezed tahitian limes will provide the fluid that you need.

In Jawa they are not called Tahitian limes, but that's what they are sold as in Oz. In my previous house I had my own tree and harvested and prepared the juice when the limes came on, then I saved the juice in the deep freeze immediately, this worked OK too.

You need to squeeze the limes, then strain the juice, then filter through clean cloth, I use an old, worn linen handerchief.

As David has said, keris staining is a very delicate process, and not real easy to get a decent result. As with any skill, it takes time to learn.

I am sure that has a lot to do with it, also my arsenic is not what it should be. I am using artists orpiment, which is arsenic trisulphide. It ought to be arsenic trioxide, but I found an old materia medica book online which details how to convert it by roasting. Since the orpiment is one tenth the price of normal arsenic trioxide, this makes sense, but it's tricky work and not the safest. If I am pleased with the results, I will take the time to detail the process, but if it doesn't work, I will have to buy the right stuff, and it's not cheap.