A folding butt carbine

[dana_w]

Thanks for the additional photos fernando. I am looking forward to learning more about your new prize.

I have spent the last several weeks rereading Dr. James Lavins book, A History of Spanish Firearms. I wish that I spoke Spanish or Portuguese. What little I know,(or think I know) comes from my father F.E. Williams (aka Jack Williams), Keith Neal and Dr. Lavin. On page 166 of Lavin's book, he says “Here 'pie' is used by Espinar in the same sense as 'patilla' in his chapter on the gunlock. The difference between the two is slight; pie normally refers to the human foot, while pata, or its diminutive, patilla, is the foot of the animal or object.”

On Page 190 Lavin talks about the Italian influence on the Castilian style. I am sure you are right about the more fish tail like Berescian stock now that I have looked at this chapter again. I do have a matchlock carbine supposedly made in Ripoll that has a stock much like the one you show here. Don't some early Catalan style butts have a much less pronounced “toe”?

The photos fooled me about the pins. I have some barrels with only pins, some with pins and barrel bands and some with only barrel bands. I hear that barrel bands only means it was made later.

That is one fascinating weapon you have there. I would love to know if there are any markings on the inside of the lock.

[fernando]

Originally Posted by dana_w

...I would love to know if there are any markings on the inside of the lock.

No marks ... but i like it though.


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[dana_w]

Wow, check out the end of that spring. Neat!

[fernando]

I sincerly hope that the engravings on mine, being visibly more pronounced, are a more elaborated craft method and an added value on these things.
Otherwise i feel a bit frustrated, as i have paid much more than the one in the auction .

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[Fernando K]

Hello:

The working method applied to the plates is not recorded, but the "tooled". Fernando would be interesting to tell us what material they are made (? Silver, nickel, iron?)

The weapon of the post 10, a blunderbuss travel has on his shield (escutcheon) a phrase in Italian, I fail to decipher: "chi non nona Legge P. ....."

The weapon of the post 13 has an inscription on the barrel LAZZAPINA. It was amended by adding a leg to the P to become R, LAZZARINO (Lazzarino Comionazo why?)

In post 14, Photo of the key, I would like to know is that little screw on the inner side of the upper jaw. Is it to hold the screw mason?

[Miqueleter]

Originally Posted by Fernando K

Hello:



In post 14, Photo of the key, I would like to know is that little screw on the inner side of the upper jaw. Is it to hold the screw mason?

Good eye, Fernando K, I noticed that top jaw screw (setscrew?) on Fernando's scavezzo as well as the ones in Malta. I have never seen that before on the classic patillas. Interesting as well is the fact the scavezzos seem to be fitted with classic patilla locks on what is basically an Italian firearm. Brescian, IMHO. But then, until this thread, I never really paid any attention to scavezzos. I would see them listed quite often in Czerny's auctions. Perhaps Fernando will verify that the screw is indeed a setscrew.

[dana_w]

I have seen setscrews before on early patilla Miquelet locks. This lock has the hole, but the screw is missing. My father purchased the lock from Dr. Lavin in 1997. The Rifle Shoppe sells a cast reproduction of it, Item #614 "James Lavin's 1650's Miquelet Lock".

[fernando]

Hola Fernando.

Originally Posted by Fernando K

Hello:
The working method applied to the plates is not recorded, but the "tooled". Fernando would be interesting to tell us what material they are made (? Silver, nickel, iron?)...

You mean not engraved but tooled; what would be the spanish term for tooled?
The material is iron.

Originally Posted by Fernando K

The weapon of the post 10, a blunderbuss travel has on his shield (escutcheon) a phrase in Italian, I fail to decipher: "chi non nona Legge P. ....." ...

Maybe an Italian could decipher it ... although the auction house is Italin and they just called it 'inscription'. I guess it is one this popular phrases, like you also find in Spanish navajas. This one sounds like a motto, like "who doesn't have law ..."

Originally Posted by Fernando K

The weapon of the post 13 has an inscription on the barrel LAZZAPINA. It was amended by adding a leg to the P to become R, LAZZARINO (Lazzarino Comionazo why?)

I think the original intention was to inscribe the word LAZZARINA, to give prestige to the weapon with such famous name. This is a common habit. The Cominazo family was Brescian, where apparently this 'Scavezzo' was made.

Originally Posted by Fernando K

In post 14, Photo of the key, I would like to know is that little screw on the inner side of the upper jaw. Is it to hold the screw mason?

Yes, the "set screw", as i have now leaerned the term in english.

[Fernando K]

Hola. tocayo

Si se me permite, voy a escribir en castellano, para que se entienda lo que quiero expresar. La técnica no es el grabado, sino el "repujado", "repousse", en francés. Se trata de desplazar el material, sin sacado de virutas....

Fernando K

In other words, the technique is not engraving but the so called "repoussé", a French term also used in english, that defines the 'displacing' of the material without shavings removal.
This technique we call in portuguese 'repuchado'.

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[dana_w]

Originally Posted by fernando

I sincerly hope that the engravings on mine, being visibly more pronounced, are a more elaborated craft method and an added value on these things.
Otherwise i feel a bit frustrated, as i have paid much more than the one in the auction .

.

Keep in mind that they had to add another 20% fee and VAT!