Anyone seen this stamp?

mahratt · 11th September 2012, 04:08 AM

Thank you very much for your answers.

Jim McDougall · 12th September 2012, 03:37 AM

Interesting question, and I think Runjeet has offering some reasonable speculation as far as the possible initials of either organization or district in the British administrative web during the Raj. The first open hilt tulwar appears to be a court or state sword which with straight blade I think is termed 'sukhela' in classifications. It is NW Indian and again by hilt form seems Rajasthani.
The one with heavy yelmaned blade is similar to others of this form and hilt which seem to be termed 'tegha', though the exact nature of this form has been disputed. The others I have seen like this also have the cartouche in similar location on blade near edge at langet, one is in "Islamic Arms and Armour from Private Danish Collections", Copenhagen, 1982, #174, as found in notes but I do not have the book. Unsure of what is in the cartouche but it seems oval. Another was sold in December, 2011 with similar hilt (these appear Rajasthani also) and the cartouche with illegible markings in oval.

I would suggest these initials may represent the official property of one of the districts in India, perhaps these arms belonged to groups or units in certain capacity. Even many large firms and railroad agencies had thier own police or security forces. I recall that one railroad agency in Baroda even had swords made in the British M1853 pattern by Rodwell & Co. made for them.

Just speculation of course, and as always, look forward to other views.

Best regards,
Jim

Jens Nordlunde · 12th September 2012, 01:51 PM

Hi Jim,
Here the tegha is.

Jim McDougall · 13th September 2012, 06:04 PM

Jens, thank you so much for posting that tegha, which gives a good comparison and for your helpful notes earlier as well.
Runjeet thank you for placing your input on this topic also.
There always seems to be a distinct aversion to participation on these kinds of topics, especially on markings on Indian arms. I think it is due mostly to the esoterica of the subject as well as the paucity of information available.

That is the reason I had hoped to establish at least some sort of benchmark here on this marking, which I think is actually etched rather than stamped. I appreciate Mahratt posting this for that opportunity, and hopefully he will offer response from his colleague and perhaps any suggestions from the forum he refers to and thier suggestions.

12th September 2012, 01:51 PM	#3
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Hi Jim, Here the tegha is. Attached Images

11th September 2012, 04:08 AM	#1
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	Thank you very much for your answers.

12th September 2012, 03:37 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,191	Interesting question, and I think Runjeet has offering some reasonable speculation as far as the possible initials of either organization or district in the British administrative web during the Raj. The first open hilt tulwar appears to be a court or state sword which with straight blade I think is termed 'sukhela' in classifications. It is NW Indian and again by hilt form seems Rajasthani. The one with heavy yelmaned blade is similar to others of this form and hilt which seem to be termed 'tegha', though the exact nature of this form has been disputed. The others I have seen like this also have the cartouche in similar location on blade near edge at langet, one is in "Islamic Arms and Armour from Private Danish Collections", Copenhagen, 1982, #174, as found in notes but I do not have the book. Unsure of what is in the cartouche but it seems oval. Another was sold in December, 2011 with similar hilt (these appear Rajasthani also) and the cartouche with illegible markings in oval. I would suggest these initials may represent the official property of one of the districts in India, perhaps these arms belonged to groups or units in certain capacity. Even many large firms and railroad agencies had thier own police or security forces. I recall that one railroad agency in Baroda even had swords made in the British M1853 pattern by Rodwell & Co. made for them. Just speculation of course, and as always, look forward to other views. Best regards, Jim

13th September 2012, 06:04 PM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,191	Jens, thank you so much for posting that tegha, which gives a good comparison and for your helpful notes earlier as well. Runjeet thank you for placing your input on this topic also. There always seems to be a distinct aversion to participation on these kinds of topics, especially on markings on Indian arms. I think it is due mostly to the esoterica of the subject as well as the paucity of information available. That is the reason I had hoped to establish at least some sort of benchmark here on this marking, which I think is actually etched rather than stamped. I appreciate Mahratt posting this for that opportunity, and hopefully he will offer response from his colleague and perhaps any suggestions from the forum he refers to and thier suggestions.