My Flyssa Daggers

[Dom]

Originally Posted by mrwizard

Do you consider the dagger in the lower right corner to be a flyssa.
I thought these things were mostly ceremonial (wedding nimcha).
btw. here is a photo of the only specimen i own (which looks more like a flyssa)... :-)

Hi mrwizard
you noticed the "flyssa" in the lower right corner, and you are intrigued
- it's really a "souvenir dagger"
- "souvenir" dated 1876,
- purchased in "Fort National" (capitale for Great Kabylie, know in our days as Tizi-Ouzou)
- by a French military; Ansel Francois, soldier the 8th battalion of "Chasseur" (hunter)
I was myself "Sgt" in this precise battalion in the 60th
you may understand my particular attraction for this "Kabyle dagger"
nothing is invented, all is engraving on the scabbard

your flissa is just amazing, I never saw with a similar handle

all the best

à +

Dom

[mrwizard]

Originally Posted by Dom

your flissa is just amazing, I never saw with a similar handle

Yes, isn't it? Looking at the workmanship our "flyssas" might be from
the same workshop

Best regards
Thilo

[Dom]

Originally Posted by mrwizard

Yes, isn't it? Looking at the workmanship our "flyssas" might be from the same workshop

Thilo,
Emanuel wrote an interesting chapter about flissa
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=11477

and give some indications about who was manufacturing flissa; 1 tribe only
but better to read the post

à +

Dom

[Emanuel]

Hi there,

The strange handle can be seen on other flyssa/nimcha variants, and on some "Berber" sabres and shula/s'boula daggers as well.

http://vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1362

http://vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=2002

Camille Lacoste Desjardins writes in her article "Sabres Kabyles" that these small flyssa-like daggers date post-1950 or so. Algiers and much of the hinterland was taken by the French in 1830, and in 1850 the French imposed a ban on weapon manufacture. Kabylia surrendered a few years alter in 1857. By then the large flyssa were no longer being made, but part of the industry continued for the smaller types, sought after by the new French colonists. While they were very well made with good blades and quality decoration, quality gradually went down until they essentially became the "wedding nimchas" with blades cut from sheet metal. I'm not sure exactly where this happened. It likely started with the Kabyle flyssa, then might have had a bit of a back and forth with Morocco. The shula/s'boula was probably an intermediary step.
This is conjecture though...Dom you may have a better sense of where the different types were available.

Emanuel

[Congoblades]

Some more Flyssa decorated with cowry shells.
In the books "Jacob, Alain, 1974 - Armes blanches de l'Afrique noire" & "Anthony C. Tirri - Islamic and native weapons of colonial Africa, 1800-1960" are simular Flyssa shown, I don't have these books so I can't show them here, maby someone can add them here?
Like you can see in the picture, below the shells the scabbard and handle are already decorated.

Greets

[Congoblades]

An interesting site about Flyssa... in french,

http://blade.japet.com/flissa1.htm

[spiral]

Originally Posted by Congoblades

An interesting site about Flyssa... in french,

http://blade.japet.com/flissa1.htm

And translated by the powers of the web in to English.......

Spiral

linky...

[Emanuel]

Originally Posted by Congoblades

Some more Flyssa decorated with cowry shells.
In the books "Jacob, Alain, 1974 - Armes blanches de l'Afrique noire" & "Anthony C. Tirri - Islamic and native weapons of colonial Africa, 1800-1960" are simular Flyssa shown, I don't have these books so I can't show them here, maby someone can add them here?
Like you can see in the picture, below the shells the scabbard and handle are already decorated.

Greets

Hello,
I like this curved flyssa variant.

It’s interesting to see that the brass handle treatment is still there under the leather and shells. Were this mine I would remove them down to the original underneath since they are a later addition. Is the original carved wooden scabbard still there?
If Jacob's Senegalese attribution of the dagger is correct, it might be explained by France's use of Senegalese Tirailleurs in Algeria in the 1940s and 1960s to put down the Algerian rebellions. Senegalese veterans could have taken them as souvenirs.

Emanuel

[Dom]

Originally Posted by Emanuel

If Jacob's Senegalese attribution of the dagger is correct, it might be explained by France's use of Senegalese Tirailleurs in Algeria in the 1940s and 1960s to put down the Algerian rebellions. Senegalese veterans could have taken them as souvenirs.

Emanuel ...
you have a large and fertile imagination
I'm agreed, that every thing, included the incredible, could be possible ...

- in 1940s the Senegalese Tirailleurs, present in Bir Hakeim - East Libya,
later have participated to the landing in Provence, and they went until Germania,
probability to carry with them a "souvenir" on long run (years)
- from 1954 to 62, they were in Algeria, as well as myself (61/62), but again,
I never saw during our operations a single "flissa" or "Algerian nimcha", main reason,
the population was too poor to hold some edged weapons like that, just kitchen knifes ...
otherwise sometimes, some very good automatic guns, what we have collected ... isn't it ... but never keep it

more realistic; THE TRADING ...
when it's not the smuggling (trabandists, in local language)
even in our days, as well as in past, since centuries, a very active and profitable business,
between; Algeria, Niger, Mali, and Mauritania (border with Senegal and Mali) guns, revolver's, machine-gun, RPJ, ammunitions, drugs, cigarettes ... etc ...
every weeks, in North Sahara (2001/04) I was buying Malb*ro RIM (Republic Islamic of Mauritania)
in very large quantity to supply American's camps (gas) in my charge, localized in Sahara
during the 6 years spent in Algeria; 1995/98 then 2001/04
I NEVER SAW A SINGLE FLISSA, long or short, even if nevertheless on weekly basic,
I went against all security measures, visit the Saharan city of Ouargla (outside of security perimeter) the shops of antiques,
I bought; ethnic jewelery, stone artifacts, never saw a dagger or sword ...
I have had talks with merchants (I speak Arabic), and asked from them edged weapons ... every time same answer; none ...
only thing, a day in Algiers, where I spent few nights, I found an old Tuareg arm dagger ("loï bo"), it's all what I found ... during all those years
the cat was skinny ... as we said here in France

my conclusion; these "flissa/nimcha" ornamented with crowie shells, are from the end of 19th,
transfered (caravan) from Sahara to African countries of Sub-Sahara,
then decorated by the merchants to comply with local fashion
this trading business, was been done before 1930, then the local situation became more critical
in 1930 the "pacification" of Sahara was accomplished, before, only Tuareg was the "masters", then,
their movements was restricted, deepest in South (as in our days ... )

less romantic, but may be more realistic, sorry to kill the poet who is residing in you

à +

Dom

[DaveA]

Here is a large (24 inches) curved flyssa with a hilt similar to the one posted by Dom. I had been thinking of this as a nimcha… It, along with the small jimbaya, are shown being worn by a "desert wallah" c. late 19th century.

Separately I will posted some other flyssas.