Talismanic symbols on moro kris blades gallery!

Battara · 18th July 2011, 03:35 PM

Very helpful Mohd thank you.

IN the Philippine world, stylized animals and "x"s are talismanic symbols. The "lizard" is in fact a stylized crocodile, a power symbol.

Maurice · 18th July 2011, 04:15 PM

Battara thank you for your contribution of sharing those wonderfull krisses.
I could imagine that the crocodile figure is for talismanic, and the defoliate decoration on the other kris more as decoration...Which I'm glad you also shared in this thread.

Unfortunately I don't have the answer of what will be only used as decoration, and what will be used as talismanic purposes.
But somewhere in the back of my head I remember I've read something in an old book (which I can't recall in my mind), that motifs, filled with silver or gold inlay, means to be there to strengthen the owner and protect him against evil or harm.
I'm sure there must be more knowledge about this here of forumites and I hope this thread will be interesting which eventually give us a good sight on what to see as decoration and what to see as talismanic purposes.

It seems that I'm not the only one having these questions, considering the posts of mohd and kino..
And this was exactly what I wanted to cause by this thread.

Please share more images and knowledge about this!
I'm getting real curious now to learn more.....

Maurice

Battara · 18th July 2011, 06:44 PM

For Moro pieces, Cato's Moro Swords is one source that is specifically tailored for Moro swords and discusses for example the "x" as a talismanic mark (p.92 for starters)...........

Other tribes that are not mentioned in Cato can be found with their talismanic symbols in Philippine textile works, like Textiles of the Southern Philippines .............

David · 18th July 2011, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

For Moro pieces, Cato's Moro Swords is one source that is specifically tailored for Moro swords and discusses for example the "x" as a talismanic mark (p.92 for starters)...........

Other tribes that are not mentioned in Cato can be found with their talismanic symbols in Philippine textile works, like Textiles of the Southern Philippines .............

Frankly José Cato refers only very briefly to the Xs on the spine of a panabas as "ornamental/talismanic", a catch-all phrase which to me seems just a bit meaningless and unsupported. That being said, i am of the mind that the "X" designs on Maurice's blade that curve inward (a very different "X" pattern than the ones Cato notes on the spine of the panabas. I don't think we can consider all type of "x" patterns to be equal) are most probably talismanic in nature. The stylized croc might also be considered to have a talismanic element (certainly the animal is considered powerful), but it seems to me that all these other markings are merely decorative.

VVV · 18th July 2011, 10:13 PM

Nice idea Maurice for a good reference thread.
I hope all will contribute so we have as many examples as possible for future references. Maybe we first should allow all forumites to post and then in another thread discuss which motifs that might be talismanic and why?
Here are variations of motifs that I suspect might be talismanic on my kris.

Michael

David · 18th July 2011, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVV

Nice idea Maurice for a good reference thread.
I hope all will contribute so we have as many examples as possible for future references. Maybe we first should allow all forumites to post and then in another thread discuss which motifs that might be talismanic and why?
Here are variations of motifs that I suspect might be talismanic on my kris.

Sorry Michael, but i don't see the point in having one thread to post the images and another to discuss the motifs.
You have posted some fine examples i think. Again i would suggest that some are strong candidates for talismanic signs while others look to be just decoration to me. Beautiful pieces all though....

VVV · 18th July 2011, 10:57 PM

David, the only reason was to keep the thread more "clean" - like the mandau face gallery.
Anyway as a response to Mohd so far I have never seen a magic square on a moro kris. I doubt that there is one but I would very much like to be proven wrong on this, maybe in this thread?
The most common muslim symbol seems to be what Cato (p. 102) refers to as the Ring of Solomon (The square with looped corners).

Michael

18th July 2011, 06:44 PM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,308	For Moro pieces, Cato's Moro Swords is one source that is specifically tailored for Moro swords and discusses for example the "x" as a talismanic mark (p.92 for starters)........... Other tribes that are not mentioned in Cato can be found with their talismanic symbols in Philippine textile works, like Textiles of the Southern Philippines ............. Last edited by Battara; 18th July 2011 at 06:55 PM.

18th July 2011, 10:13 PM	#5
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Nice idea Maurice for a good reference thread. I hope all will contribute so we have as many examples as possible for future references. Maybe we first should allow all forumites to post and then in another thread discuss which motifs that might be talismanic and why? Here are variations of motifs that I suspect might be talismanic on my kris. Michael Attached Images

18th July 2011, 03:35 PM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,308	Very helpful Mohd thank you. IN the Philippine world, stylized animals and "x"s are talismanic symbols. The "lizard" is in fact a stylized crocodile, a power symbol.

18th July 2011, 04:15 PM	#2
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,456	Battara thank you for your contribution of sharing those wonderfull krisses. I could imagine that the crocodile figure is for talismanic, and the defoliate decoration on the other kris more as decoration...Which I'm glad you also shared in this thread. Unfortunately I don't have the answer of what will be only used as decoration, and what will be used as talismanic purposes. But somewhere in the back of my head I remember I've read something in an old book (which I can't recall in my mind), that motifs, filled with silver or gold inlay, means to be there to strengthen the owner and protect him against evil or harm. I'm sure there must be more knowledge about this here of forumites and I hope this thread will be interesting which eventually give us a good sight on what to see as decoration and what to see as talismanic purposes. It seems that I'm not the only one having these questions, considering the posts of mohd and kino.. And this was exactly what I wanted to cause by this thread. Please share more images and knowledge about this! I'm getting real curious now to learn more..... Maurice

18th July 2011, 10:57 PM	#7
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	David, the only reason was to keep the thread more "clean" - like the mandau face gallery. Anyway as a response to Mohd so far I have never seen a magic square on a moro kris. I doubt that there is one but I would very much like to be proven wrong on this, maybe in this thread? The most common muslim symbol seems to be what Cato (p. 102) refers to as the Ring of Solomon (The square with looped corners). Michael