? on recently acquired Japanese swords

[knife7knut]

Originally Posted by koto

they are fake from China

Are there certain features that make this so obvious? I am far from knowledgeable in relation to Japanese edged weapons but have a considerable collection of Western pocket and fixed blade knives;many of them quite old and can usually tell the difference between a genuinely old knife and a simulated one.
I ask this because I am always wanting to learn more.

[laEspadaAncha]

Hi Knife7knut,

Another folder/fixed blade collector...

A good - but by no means exhaustive - resource and primer on spotting knock-off nihonto can be found here:

http://www.jssus.org/nkp/fake_japanese_swords.html

With regards to your examples, while I would hesitate to even qualify or consider myself as a "student" of nihonto (though I am fortunate enough to have a couple in my own collection), as Rich mentioned, the (weld) patterns on your blades appear to be etched. You will not find acid-etched blades on an authentic nihonto. At the website above, you can see the difference between an etched blade and the visible 'activity' in a polished nihonto.

Now, regarding Koto's observation ("koto" means "old sword" in Japanese), he (at least I'm assuming Koto is a "he") must have picked up on clues/cues from the koshirae (mountings) itself, and it would be instructive for me to hear & learn what he observed that led him to a definitive conclusion.

Another good resource (my personal favorite) is Rich's website, to which a link can be found in the signature of his posts.

In the world of ethnographic edged weaponry, probably no other form is as revered - or copied - as the nihonto. And remember that the 'application' of patina is in itself a cottage industry in China, where they have been knocking off their own antiques for centuries...

While the fittings may appear to have age, I've seen quality (knock off) koshirae attached to Chinese blades...

Anyway, hope this helps. Additional photos of the blades and tangs would help knowledgable members like Rich and Koto give you more detailed feedback about your swords and the telltale signs that would indicate or refute their authenticity.

[koto]

Originally Posted by knife7knut

Are there certain features that make this so obvious? I am far from knowledgeable in relation to Japanese edged weapons but have a considerable collection of Western pocket and fixed blade knives;many of them quite old and can usually tell the difference between a genuinely old knife and a simulated one.
I ask this because I am always wanting to learn more.

Actually nothing smell right there -- the shape of the whole thing, the wrap, the shape and the fittings of / on the handle, the workmanship of the tsuba, the detail of the scabbard, the kogatana, the forging grian of the blade...... Don't learn anything from these two. They are not the right things. Buy a real Nihonto and it will tell you a lot!