The Sendai Keris

Battara · 17th February 2011, 03:50 AM

Thank you - I now see it as gloss and not metal shine. Helpful.

Gustav · 17th February 2011, 09:30 AM

Jose, these white stains are places, where ground coat is visible.

The sheath is made from one piece of wood, gandar iras, like all sheaths, which can be traced back to the first half of 17. cent. Gambar is unfortunately broken (the wright side).

Gustav · 17th February 2011, 11:05 AM

Regarding hilt and selut, there probably are some mysterious things. For such high quality keris and sheath the match of hilt and selut is very bad. Selut is clearly to small for the hilt (which must be very huge, even compared to keris), this selut is the only one of this type I have seen with such an early provenance, and looks, how can I say it, modern designed compared to the rest.

David · 17th February 2011, 02:19 PM

I am a little hesitant to enter this conversation when so little about the origin of this keris is know and the photos are so bad. Where do people believe this keris is originally from. From what i can see, to my eyes it looks a little Balinese. Certainly the hilt form, though a bit different from later styles, looks that way due to the type of selut and figurative hilt. Also what appeas to be two fullers reaching down most of the blade is a common feature on Bali blades. If indeed we are looking at a keris that has been unchanged since it's collection in the early 1600s i'm not sure that we can really say without a full understanding of the origins of this keris whether of not this is a proper ensemble or not.
And Barry, if it was collected in the Philippines it may well be something pick up in travel, not a formal royal presentation, because this clearly is not of the Philipinnes. Given that scenerio it would be unlikely that the hilt was made specially for the Japanese ruler. It may well have had some age at the time.
If the diplomat had made his way to Bali or Jawa to receive this then the story might be different. But i doubt that they would create a hilt depicting a Japanese deity for this. Certainly figurative hilts like this were being created in Bali at that time.

Gustav · 18th February 2011, 12:05 AM

In Tropenmuseum there is (much younger) Balinese keris of somewhat similar appearance (picture borrowed from Maurice). I suppose, such feature as this selut is not known in Java.

I think, we can accept hilt and selut as a bad fit, becouse selut is not covering bungkul.

It is clear, that gambar is being repainted with a symbol, which could be regarded as a christian one. With some certainity the repainting is done in the same style as alas-alasan on gandar, some colours are the same, some differ.

I am not sure if we can call this keris a pick up, becouse it is a really high quality keris and Hasekura Tsunenaga was a diplomat on official mission. After beeing in Spain and Rome he stayed for two years in Manila before returning to Japan. It is a speculation, nothing about this part of his voyage is known, yet I don't think he was staying in this town all the time, and his staying there before the fulfilment of his mission should have some reason.

David · 18th February 2011, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gustav

I am not sure if we can call this keris a pick up, becouse it is a really high quality keris and Hasekura Tsunenaga was a diplomat on official mission. After beeing in Spain and Rome he stayed for two years in Manila before returning to Japan. It is a speculation, nothing about this part of his voyage is known, yet I don't think he was staying in this town all the time, and his staying there before the fulfilment of his mission should have some reason.

Well Gustav, it certain does appear to be a keris of court quality, yet there does not seem to be any evidence that this diplomat met with members of the Balinese (or Javanese if this is of that origin) members of court. Perhaps not a "pick-up" as a tourist might gather, but also not a gift directly for it's point of origin as far as i can tell.

David · 18th February 2011, 04:00 PM

Can someone also explain to be what the supposed Christian symbol is that appears on the sarong. I can not see any such thing in the photos presented.

18th February 2011, 12:05 AM	#5
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	In Tropenmuseum there is (much younger) Balinese keris of somewhat similar appearance (picture borrowed from Maurice). I suppose, such feature as this selut is not known in Java. I think, we can accept hilt and selut as a bad fit, becouse selut is not covering bungkul. It is clear, that gambar is being repainted with a symbol, which could be regarded as a christian one. With some certainity the repainting is done in the same style as alas-alasan on gandar, some colours are the same, some differ. I am not sure if we can call this keris a pick up, becouse it is a really high quality keris and Hasekura Tsunenaga was a diplomat on official mission. After beeing in Spain and Rome he stayed for two years in Manila before returning to Japan. It is a speculation, nothing about this part of his voyage is known, yet I don't think he was staying in this town all the time, and his staying there before the fulfilment of his mission should have some reason. Attached Images

17th February 2011, 03:50 AM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	Thank you - I now see it as gloss and not metal shine. Helpful.

17th February 2011, 09:30 AM	#2
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	Jose, these white stains are places, where ground coat is visible. The sheath is made from one piece of wood, gandar iras, like all sheaths, which can be traced back to the first half of 17. cent. Gambar is unfortunately broken (the wright side).

17th February 2011, 11:05 AM	#3
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,273	Regarding hilt and selut, there probably are some mysterious things. For such high quality keris and sheath the match of hilt and selut is very bad. Selut is clearly to small for the hilt (which must be very huge, even compared to keris), this selut is the only one of this type I have seen with such an early provenance, and looks, how can I say it, modern designed compared to the rest.

17th February 2011, 02:19 PM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	I am a little hesitant to enter this conversation when so little about the origin of this keris is know and the photos are so bad. Where do people believe this keris is originally from. From what i can see, to my eyes it looks a little Balinese. Certainly the hilt form, though a bit different from later styles, looks that way due to the type of selut and figurative hilt. Also what appeas to be two fullers reaching down most of the blade is a common feature on Bali blades. If indeed we are looking at a keris that has been unchanged since it's collection in the early 1600s i'm not sure that we can really say without a full understanding of the origins of this keris whether of not this is a proper ensemble or not. And Barry, if it was collected in the Philippines it may well be something pick up in travel, not a formal royal presentation, because this clearly is not of the Philipinnes. Given that scenerio it would be unlikely that the hilt was made specially for the Japanese ruler. It may well have had some age at the time. If the diplomat had made his way to Bali or Jawa to receive this then the story might be different. But i doubt that they would create a hilt depicting a Japanese deity for this. Certainly figurative hilts like this were being created in Bali at that time.

18th February 2011, 04:00 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Can someone also explain to be what the supposed Christian symbol is that appears on the sarong. I can not see any such thing in the photos presented.