Ottoman Turkish inscription: Need single word translated

Atlantia · 3rd November 2010, 10:47 PM

David.
Cheers mate, nice to find something good all the way down here in the burbs.

Robert.
Your collection is so damn good! My Kindjal would be lost in its beauty!

Thank you guys

I've really 'put out the feelers' on this one. I've spoken to a chap by email who a fellow kind forumite put me in the direction of. He collects Kindjals, and I believe has a dozen or so pattern welded ones in his collection.
Luckily, he very kindly answered my 'newbie' Kindjal collecting questions.
He agrees with the majority view that this is definately a Turkish example, he says that it is very unusually late for the pattern to be so clear and that they (twistcores I presume) are usually from Tbilisi or Batumi, Turkish and Dagestani tend to be more rare.

So rare amongst the rare!
I've never even seen another genuine twistcore Kindjal in person, of any style or type, so to me it's truly uber-rare!
So you can see why I'm pee'd-off that I can't read the makers name

Someone must be able to read it?

Best
Gene

Atlantia · 7th November 2010, 12:16 PM

A kind forumite suggested that it looked like 'H'
As in 'Amel H' ?

Zifir · 8th November 2010, 01:43 PM

That forumite is also shilly-shallying about his reading of the script

If I am allowed to correct my mistake, it is B and H (I think). I can't find suitable vocalization for this word though. Assuming this is a specific Caucasian name, rather than a Turkish one, all we need is to find someone who is familiar with languages and names of that area.

Atlantia · 8th November 2010, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zifir

That forumite is also shilly-shallying about his reading of the script

If I am allowed to correct my mistake, it is B and H (I think). I can't find suitable vocalization for this word though. Assuming this is a specific Caucasian name, rather than a Turkish one, all we need is to find someone who is familiar with languages and names of that area.

LOL!!! Shilly-shallying is a great phrase!

Thank you for your continued support in trying to decipher this word Zifir.

I have now emailed a seller of Kindjals in Georgia, and an expert in Turkish/Ottoman scripts/caligraphy in Istanbul.

It's entirely possible of course, that I won't get replies (as I don't actually know either person so I'm kind of hoping they will have the time to indulge a strangers request).
But if at least one does reply, then hopefully that will either translate the missing word or exclude that line of enquiry.

This sword has really grown on me, I really do hope I can learn as much about it as possible.
It has (as acquiring a treasured weapon always does) led me to think about its history, owner and how it probobly ended up being brought back to England. Terrible possibilities, Gallipoli, that dreadful campaign and so many wasted lives. The bravery of the Turkish troops and the losses on both sides.
For what?
Not so long ago, only just beyond living memory.
I find myself hoping it wasn't taken from a fallen soldier. But so many 'foreign' antique weapons in England are here because they were.

Best
Gene

TVV · 9th November 2010, 01:28 AM

Accounts of the Gallipoli campaign do not suggest the Entente soldiers had plenty of time to go about souvenir collecting, as they barely held a foothold, before being driven out with terrible losses.

I would think a more likely story would be a British traveller in the area, perhaps even prior to the Great War. If we assume, of course that the kindjal made the journey North-West a century or so ago, and not as a collectible in more modern times.

Regards,
Teodor

Atlantia · 9th November 2010, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TVV

Accounts of the Gallipoli campaign do not suggest the Entente soldiers had plenty of time to go about souvenir collecting, as they barely held a foothold, before being driven out with terrible losses.

I would think a more likely story would be a British traveller in the area, perhaps even prior to the Great War. If we assume, of course that the kindjal made the journey North-West a century or so ago, and not as a collectible in more modern times.

Regards,
Teodor

Hi Teodor,

It comes to something when the only part of a campaign that size that went well was the retreat!
I would much rather it was a gift or peacetime bringback.

Best
Gene

Atlantia · 9th November 2010, 09:48 PM

Well I'm going for all the long shots now, so just in case someone who is reading this but isn't registered can help with the translation, I can be reached by email at: gimmieitbaby@aol.com
Thanks
Gene

3rd November 2010, 10:47 PM	#1
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	David. Cheers mate, nice to find something good all the way down here in the burbs. Robert. Your collection is so damn good! My Kindjal would be lost in its beauty! Thank you guys I've really 'put out the feelers' on this one. I've spoken to a chap by email who a fellow kind forumite put me in the direction of. He collects Kindjals, and I believe has a dozen or so pattern welded ones in his collection. Luckily, he very kindly answered my 'newbie' Kindjal collecting questions. He agrees with the majority view that this is definately a Turkish example, he says that it is very unusually late for the pattern to be so clear and that they (twistcores I presume) are usually from Tbilisi or Batumi, Turkish and Dagestani tend to be more rare. So rare amongst the rare! I've never even seen another genuine twistcore Kindjal in person, of any style or type, so to me it's truly uber-rare! So you can see why I'm pee'd-off that I can't read the makers name Someone must be able to read it? Best Gene

7th November 2010, 12:16 PM	#2
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	A kind forumite suggested that it looked like 'H' As in 'Amel H' ?

8th November 2010, 01:43 PM	#3
Zifir Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Istanbul Posts: 228	That forumite is also shilly-shallying about his reading of the script If I am allowed to correct my mistake, it is B and H (I think). I can't find suitable vocalization for this word though. Assuming this is a specific Caucasian name, rather than a Turkish one, all we need is to find someone who is familiar with languages and names of that area.

9th November 2010, 01:28 AM	#5
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,660	Accounts of the Gallipoli campaign do not suggest the Entente soldiers had plenty of time to go about souvenir collecting, as they barely held a foothold, before being driven out with terrible losses. I would think a more likely story would be a British traveller in the area, perhaps even prior to the Great War. If we assume, of course that the kindjal made the journey North-West a century or so ago, and not as a collectible in more modern times. Regards, Teodor

9th November 2010, 09:48 PM	#7
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Well I'm going for all the long shots now, so just in case someone who is reading this but isn't registered can help with the translation, I can be reached by email at: gimmieitbaby@aol.com Thanks Gene