Pattern-welded (twist core) Budiak

Emanuel · 1st November 2010, 03:43 AM

Hi everyone,

Here is a Moro or Bagobo spear with similar lozenge flaring at the base. The blade is pattern-welded but not twist-core. I find the braided wire work quite interesting.

Emanuel

Rick · 1st November 2010, 03:08 PM

The head seems almost identical to the left one shown in post #2 .

Emanuel · 2nd November 2010, 12:41 AM

Yup, that's why I posted it

. If I followed the discussion correctly, is there budding consensus that this is an early form of budiak?

Rick · 2nd November 2010, 02:21 AM

I've got my doubts about that .

I expect we need a workable, generally acceptable descriptive definition of 'Budiak'; is it just a generic term for 'Southern Philippine Muslim Spear' ?

Anyone ?

Battara · 2nd November 2010, 02:35 AM

Well it depends. I have heard that on the one hand it is a Sulu term for spear, but that type of spear as the chiseling we have been speaking of and the flair. However, other Moros have similar types of spearhead as well as other spears. I go with the last version until proven differently.

On this last spear presented, no, I would classify it more as Lumad, perhaps Bagobo.

Rick · 2nd November 2010, 02:51 AM

What's bugging me here is this question :

Did ALL the S. Philippines tribes regardless of religious orientation possess the same level of metalworking skills ??

If not; could these spear heads have possibly been sourced from other groups or areas ?

The uniform quality of workmanship begs this question IMO .

Rick

Battara · 2nd November 2010, 04:28 AM

I know that the Lumad tribes traded with Moros and acquired twist core, for example, and other steels. For this reason, I would say that when it came to steel, probably the Moros were closest in access and trade with their Indonesian cousins and thus had better access to steel techniques (again twist core for example).

Also the forms change between different tribes, but the workmanship is still good.

1st November 2010, 03:43 AM	#1
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Hi everyone, Here is a Moro or Bagobo spear with similar lozenge flaring at the base. The blade is pattern-welded but not twist-core. I find the braided wire work quite interesting. Emanuel Attached Images

2nd November 2010, 02:51 AM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	So ....... What's bugging me here is this question : Did ALL the S. Philippines tribes regardless of religious orientation possess the same level of metalworking skills ?? If not; could these spear heads have possibly been sourced from other groups or areas ? The uniform quality of workmanship begs this question IMO . Rick

1st November 2010, 03:08 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	The head seems almost identical to the left one shown in post #2 .

2nd November 2010, 12:41 AM	#3
Emanuel Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 1,242	Yup, that's why I posted it . If I followed the discussion correctly, is there budding consensus that this is an early form of budiak?

2nd November 2010, 02:21 AM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,336	I've got my doubts about that . I expect we need a workable, generally acceptable descriptive definition of 'Budiak'; is it just a generic term for 'Southern Philippine Muslim Spear' ? Anyone ?

2nd November 2010, 02:35 AM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	Well it depends. I have heard that on the one hand it is a Sulu term for spear, but that type of spear as the chiseling we have been speaking of and the flair. However, other Moros have similar types of spearhead as well as other spears. I go with the last version until proven differently. On this last spear presented, no, I would classify it more as Lumad, perhaps Bagobo.

2nd November 2010, 04:28 AM	#7
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,272	I know that the Lumad tribes traded with Moros and acquired twist core, for example, and other steels. For this reason, I would say that when it came to steel, probably the Moros were closest in access and trade with their Indonesian cousins and thus had better access to steel techniques (again twist core for example). Also the forms change between different tribes, but the workmanship is still good.