Cold Steel Naval Dirk: Origin of Design?

Atlantia · 16th October 2010, 08:11 PM

Well I checked it today and compared it to the cold-steel dirk.
It is one, for sure.
Dirtied and deliberately aged.
Looked good too!

Dmitry · 18th October 2010, 04:20 AM

Well, if that's the case I'm glad you didn't buy it! We've all seen this type of thing,aging the repros, quite a bit in the recent years. Most of the time these are quite obvious, but they are getting better every year.
Nevertheless, there are still many good period examples of naval dirks out there, especially in the UK.

kronckew · 18th October 2010, 07:02 AM

well, sunday they played the gregory peck version of the horatio hornblower movie.

i paid particular attention to the midshipman who had a dirk very much like the ivory handled examples above. the costuming in general was fairly accurate, except for the officers carrying the same style brass gripped smallswords into battle when they boarded the spanish ship of the line. even the spanish captain. i would have expected hangers...the officers even had slightly different colour uniforms and facings which would have been fairly accurate given fading, salt spray exposure and tailoring variations in natural dyed cloth.

the men even carried the correct straight bladed spectacle guarded cutlass pattern they pulled off racks. the middie carried the dirk on a broad black leather baldric that let it hang at an angle on his left hip, baldric decorated with a gold anchor and another device i couldn't quite make out, may have been a lion face, just below it.

the movie officers carried their swords inserted into a white frog which engaged a brass stud on the scabbard. didn't look like the sword belt i used in the military which was the std. black leather brass buckled and fitted belt with two carry straps for the two rings on a naval sword scabbard (and a hook to hang it on while walking rather than on horse). the brits i thought used a very similar sword belt.

i wonder how much research into accuracy they do for big budget films like that. i'd guess the officer's sword were chosen more for the flashy errol flynn style boarding duels than accuracy tho.

M ELEY · 19th October 2010, 09:55 AM

To date, the most impressive and accurate depiction of naval weapons for me was in 'Master and Commander'. From the classic British boarding axes and m1803 boarding cutlasses being rolled out onto the deck in a barrel to the officer's swords mounted in the Captain's cabin to the French flintlock pistols. In one scene, Russel Crowe gets stabbed in the side by a naval dirk...one of my favorite movies!

Atlantia · 19th October 2010, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitry

Well, if that's the case I'm glad you didn't buy it! We've all seen this type of thing,aging the repros, quite a bit in the recent years. Most of the time these are quite obvious, but they are getting better every year.
Nevertheless, there are still many good period examples of naval dirks out there, especially in the UK.

Thank you Dmitry

The unsettling thing about this repro is that there are no makers marks and given the right treatment, the brass mounts, horn hilt and non stainless blade can suddenly look like an obscure dirk of genuine age and good quality.
The scabbard is a little 'thick' with its wood liner, but with the right signs of age and use everywhere else, its easy to overlook that!
I just want to bring this to everyones attention.
I don't think for a second that it would have fooled an experienced Dirk collector like yourself, but someone like me who sees what seems to be a nice old dirk and thinks it could be the start of a dirk collection, could get caught and lose a good amount of money.
After all, the item in question is essentially a modern knife in 'well used' condition (at best) so its value is in reality now very little.

As a rider on this, I'd like to add that the chap selling it I GENUINELY believe doesn't know its a fake.
I've now bought two nice genuine items from him and he has many more.
I intend to tell him (or point him in the right direction to see for himself) next time I see him, as I hope he'll want to know.

Best
Gene

16th October 2010, 08:11 PM	#1
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Well I checked it today and compared it to the cold-steel dirk. It is one, for sure. Dirtied and deliberately aged. Looked good too!

18th October 2010, 04:20 AM	#2
Dmitry Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 607	Well, if that's the case I'm glad you didn't buy it! We've all seen this type of thing,aging the repros, quite a bit in the recent years. Most of the time these are quite obvious, but they are getting better every year. Nevertheless, there are still many good period examples of naval dirks out there, especially in the UK.

18th October 2010, 07:02 AM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	well, sunday they played the gregory peck version of the horatio hornblower movie. i paid particular attention to the midshipman who had a dirk very much like the ivory handled examples above. the costuming in general was fairly accurate, except for the officers carrying the same style brass gripped smallswords into battle when they boarded the spanish ship of the line. even the spanish captain. i would have expected hangers...the officers even had slightly different colour uniforms and facings which would have been fairly accurate given fading, salt spray exposure and tailoring variations in natural dyed cloth. the men even carried the correct straight bladed spectacle guarded cutlass pattern they pulled off racks. the middie carried the dirk on a broad black leather baldric that let it hang at an angle on his left hip, baldric decorated with a gold anchor and another device i couldn't quite make out, may have been a lion face, just below it. the movie officers carried their swords inserted into a white frog which engaged a brass stud on the scabbard. didn't look like the sword belt i used in the military which was the std. black leather brass buckled and fitted belt with two carry straps for the two rings on a naval sword scabbard (and a hook to hang it on while walking rather than on horse). the brits i thought used a very similar sword belt. i wonder how much research into accuracy they do for big budget films like that. i'd guess the officer's sword were chosen more for the flashy errol flynn style boarding duels than accuracy tho.

19th October 2010, 09:55 AM	#4
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	To date, the most impressive and accurate depiction of naval weapons for me was in 'Master and Commander'. From the classic British boarding axes and m1803 boarding cutlasses being rolled out onto the deck in a barrel to the officer's swords mounted in the Captain's cabin to the French flintlock pistols. In one scene, Russel Crowe gets stabbed in the side by a naval dirk...one of my favorite movies!