Paint primer on old weapons?

fernando · 27th April 2010, 01:12 PM

Hi Mark,
During Portuguese discoveries, colonial swords,the so called crab style, were painted black, firstly to prevent rust and aledgely also to avoid denouncing their presence in action, due to steel shining ... or vice versa!
There are inventories of the period (XVI century), listing them as "board black swords". The term "board" showing evidence of their naval use.
Fernando

fernando · 27th April 2010, 02:38 PM

Also wooden stocks were covered with primers to avoid worm rot.
By the turning of the XVIII-XIX there was a gunsmith established in Braga (North Portugal), who has become popular by producing low cost muskets, that were massively required by imigrants going to reside in Brazil and Angola.
Hi name was Lazaro, and so was his father; due to this he decided to sign the guns with "Lazaro Lazarino legitimo de (legitimate from) Braga", in order not to be confused with the famous Italian Cominazos.
These muskets became so popular that all period hunting muskets were generically named "Lazarinas".
It is widely known that he used to finish these guns stocks with a red paint, to prevent rotting with worm and tropical moisture.

Fernando

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M ELEY · 27th April 2010, 03:42 PM

Fantastic information, Fernando, thank you! I must do more research on the blackened "board black swords" you mention. That is a magnificent gun you picure. The red stock is quite nice. Is it one from your collection?

fernando · 27th April 2010, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M ELEY

... The red stock is quite nice. Is it one from your collection?...

Oh no; i have selected the more "close up" one from those illustrated in two of my books.
Not that they are extremely rare; you may find them for sale every now and then.
However examples spotted are often of very low quality. There were those made by Lazaro Lazarino, those imported from Belgium, and later even from Birmingham, to feed the increasing demand. Also Liege made their own exports to Africa.
And finally the African started making their own replicas, with barrels made of water pipes ... the usual stuff, with the stocks fully decorated with brass nails, etc.
As a matter of fact, these guns achieved the status of currency; they could be traded for women and, later, they were currency for the buying of slave boys ... as witnessed by Livingstone.
But i believe the red finishing in the stocks was a particular characteristic only used by Lazaro Lazarino.
Fernando

M ELEY · 27th April 2010, 08:12 PM

Trading guns for women...those were the days-

Yes, I have seen the Leige export types. I have a boarding pistol circa 1810 with Leige marks that I'm told was also exported to Africa as a cavalry pistol. Quite a difference. The reason I thought about it is that the wood is indeed a brownish red stain. Very interesting.

Norm, that is an incredible piece you have there. Cutlass all the way, I say. it makes sense that it would likewise copy the British patterns, in that the U.K. had such a foothold in India at that time. And of course, let us not forget about the Indian pirates (

). They were a powerful force in their day. This is really a great piece, Norman!

M ELEY · 11th March 2012, 05:33 AM

Bringing this one up again to ask an important question. If one assumes the old red primer was put on the weapon later, would you remove it? If so, how can one remove the old stain without damaging the patina? Opinions? Suggestions? I was thinking perhaps a chemical paint remover? I'm a big fan of pineapple juice for ethno pieces, but that tends to "shine up" the iron and I don't want that...

G. McCormack · 12th March 2012, 04:44 AM

If anyone is interested in the technical side of modern and historical conservations techniques as they pertain to ferrous products, I'd highly recommend:

Iron and Steel: Corrosion, Colorants, Conservation by David Scott

An answer to M Eley, if I wanted to remove old pigments such as primers, I would begin with acetone. However, your mileage may vary. Cheers

27th April 2010, 02:38 PM	#2
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Also wooden stocks were covered with primers to avoid worm rot. By the turning of the XVIII-XIX there was a gunsmith established in Braga (North Portugal), who has become popular by producing low cost muskets, that were massively required by imigrants going to reside in Brazil and Angola. Hi name was Lazaro, and so was his father; due to this he decided to sign the guns with "Lazaro Lazarino legitimo de (legitimate from) Braga", in order not to be confused with the famous Italian Cominazos. These muskets became so popular that all period hunting muskets were generically named "Lazarinas". It is widely known that he used to finish these guns stocks with a red paint, to prevent rotting with worm and tropical moisture. Fernando . Attached Images

27th April 2010, 01:12 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Hi Mark, During Portuguese discoveries, colonial swords,the so called crab style, were painted black, firstly to prevent rust and aledgely also to avoid denouncing their presence in action, due to steel shining ... or vice versa! There are inventories of the period (XVI century), listing them as "board black swords". The term "board" showing evidence of their naval use. Fernando

27th April 2010, 03:42 PM	#3
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,184	Fantastic information, Fernando, thank you! I must do more research on the blackened "board black swords" you mention. That is a magnificent gun you picure. The red stock is quite nice. Is it one from your collection?

27th April 2010, 08:12 PM	#5
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,184	Trading guns for women...those were the days- Yes, I have seen the Leige export types. I have a boarding pistol circa 1810 with Leige marks that I'm told was also exported to Africa as a cavalry pistol. Quite a difference. The reason I thought about it is that the wood is indeed a brownish red stain. Very interesting. Norm, that is an incredible piece you have there. Cutlass all the way, I say. it makes sense that it would likewise copy the British patterns, in that the U.K. had such a foothold in India at that time. And of course, let us not forget about the Indian pirates ( ). They were a powerful force in their day. This is really a great piece, Norman!

11th March 2012, 05:33 AM	#6
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,184	Bringing this one up again to ask an important question. If one assumes the old red primer was put on the weapon later, would you remove it? If so, how can one remove the old stain without damaging the patina? Opinions? Suggestions? I was thinking perhaps a chemical paint remover? I'm a big fan of pineapple juice for ethno pieces, but that tends to "shine up" the iron and I don't want that...

12th March 2012, 04:44 AM	#7
G. McCormack Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 131	If anyone is interested in the technical side of modern and historical conservations techniques as they pertain to ferrous products, I'd highly recommend: Iron and Steel: Corrosion, Colorants, Conservation by David Scott An answer to M Eley, if I wanted to remove old pigments such as primers, I would begin with acetone. However, your mileage may vary. Cheers